My NEW XF200 qingqi (Pics!)

Hello people of the board!

I just got my baby about two weeks ago (Despite my camera saying last year). I do have some general questions that I couldn't find in the forums.

By the sounds of it, I have the same stock gearing everyone's talking about. It seems to be that it is reving quite high. Before I know it, I'm in 5th gear and putting down the road going 45mph @ 5500rpm (or 73kph for you normal people). This may be wrong because I just hooked up a vapor dash computer, and I think it's not setup properly. Is this normal? stock instrument shows 55mph @ 6500rpm... waaaaay off! More like 55mph @ 7200rpm

My vapor computer shows at least 800rpm's higher than the stock instrument, and it also shows about 5-8mph lower than the stock instrument. Wierd, but I trust it being that it has exact wheel measurements and it tied into the spark system.

Anyhow, I love this little bike! It just needs some waking up (gearing and Pipe).

Lastly, where art thou bike parts store? I was looking online and there doesn't seem to be any qingqi or qlink OEM part locations.

Attachment 2301Attachment 2302Attachment 2303Attachment 2304Attachment 2305

Thanks for your time,
Greg

It’s interesting maybe you can get the 16 tooth front sprocket and then check the rpms and relative speed after its installed? I would like to know what your rpms are at 45mph after you put it on.

That sprocket is next, because everyone says they love theirs much better after the 16tooth install.

What is the normal temp these little bikes are supposed to hover around? Mines rolling around the 210deg [+/- 30deg].

I feel better now, I took all of that emissions stuff off and it seems a little cooler and smoother (that's a word right? smoother-est-ful?...)

Yeppers, The rpms are a little high. My vapor is still not setup correctly, Has anyone put this in? The rmps are very jumpy and wierd. I think I need to figure out the fire-ing config. Most 1cyl. engines fire once per revolution, so that's what I set it to. Maybe I'll find the low-voltage direct connect rather than doing the spark plug wrap-around...

I think this thread would be better off in the enduro section. Either way, Your input is valuable to me.

Thanks for your time,
Greg

Hi mate, where abouts are you? If you want to know about parts availability etc. then folk need to know that. This isn't a busy forum but if you hang around and chat then usually someone experienced and knowledgeable will join in, give them time as some are weekenders, some are busy. You can search the threads about your make of 'bike and send a private enquiry to other owners as well. Good luck.

Sorry bout that, I'm in the USA. Minnesota to be exact.

What did you take off that is an emission control?

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What did you take off that is an emission control?

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I dont know the specific names of the parts, but I can tell you what they do. There was one part that basically took air directly from the intake box and injected it into the exhaust portion of the head. The other isn't much of an emissions part, but it free's up some space by the battery and cleans the overall look of the engine bay. The other part was a canister with a charcoal insert that collected fuel fumes from the gas tank while is wasnt running and injects it right into the intake manifold after the carb.

The air injection into the exhaust port just creates more heat, dunno why.

Oh this thing…yeah that is ugly how did seal close the port off?
http://www.telecable.es/personales/a...ust/125sai.jpg

It would heat the engine wouldn’t it, since its sending hot exhaust back into the induction. It must take a certain amount of exhaust and send it back to get burned again?

I would like to see a compression test before and after? I wonder if it makes a difference or not? I agree the engine would look cleaners without it.

You looking into mufflers too? I want to get one made to match the original less the catalytic element….
http://www.telecable.es/personales/a.../catalyser.jpg
Did you make a plate to seal the exhaust port and what did you use for a gasket? Pictures?

Pics? Yes, in a day or two.

I just left the (#5) part on the engine and threaded a bolt into in and sort of electrical taped it until I could get a bracket and seal made to take it from the engine.

That catalyser was drilled out by a 12in drill-bit. and it did seem to make a small difference. smaaaall difference.

I think a larger jet and better exhaust would make a world of difference. people were saying 127mainjet was great. I just found a 16t front sprocket and am waiting on that.

Just found out that the speedo was waaaaay off! when I thought I was going 55mph... Nope I was going 48ish-mph. Thanks to the vapor computer I'm on track now. I'm still trying to figure out the tach because I dont know what to believe. When the orig. tach is reading 4000rpm, the vapor is reading 5000rpm. it almost 1000rpm off at all stages!

seems a little hokey to me...

125 main jet and a 35 slow jet
Suzuki part numbers 09491-25010 and 09492-35008

That and a good muffler would make all the difference, drilling a hole in the catalytic device would not do much to eliminate the back pressure, its still being restricted.

I do not think my speedometer is off by 7mph…I would notice that, maybe 2-3mph.

I am totally certain my tachometer is not off by 1000 rpm that would mean I am idling at 300-500 rpm and that’s not possible.

You do realize the speedometer reads primary in Kilometers per Hour
and secondary in miles per hour? There is a 62% difference and that is about what your seeing?
http://i784.photobucket.com/albums/y...ingqi/XPKM.jpg

This next one is the 16/45 tooth setup with the transmission calculations.
It's kinda cool because it all rpms through the gears This seems the most favorable.
Attachment 2330

This next one is the stock setup of 15/48 and it seem more favorable that my vapor is rockin steady.
Attachment 2332

I've heard that this is the stock setup for some people (15/45) and it works out to be exactly the same as the 16/48 setup.
Attachment 2331

If there is anything I should change, let me know and I'll run it through agian. As a side note, the vapor is correctly displaying these rpm rather than the stock tach.

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I am totally certain my tachometer is not off by 1000 rpm that would mean I am idling at 300-500 rpm and that’s not possible.

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It seems that the idle rpm is right on, but the second you leave 2500-3000rpms, it gradually goes bannana sammich.

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You do realize the speedometer reads primary in Kilometers per Hour
and secondary in miles per hour?

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Yeppers! I do know that they are mph on the inside.

More pics are still commin, If you want em'

Update!
I've noticed that I have a strange colored spark plug. It is bone white on one side of the spark plug, where-as the other side shows good color. Has anyone seen that before? is it bad?

I’ve been looking into the EGR that’s the device you removed, exhaust gas re-circulator. It actually lowers combustion temp by sending non-flammable exhaust gas back into the combustion chamber. It adds about 6-10% of the air component in the Air/fuel mix, it dilutes it. That keeps the combustion temperature down and in turn reduces the production of Nitrous Oxide that occurs over 2500 degrees.
May be the cause of the white plug? Your fuel mix is to lean? Since the air was being diluted by the exhaust then would that require less fuel? It may need to be enriched? Then there may be some concern that the timing is not correct for the engine without the EGR? That EGR may be more integral that you originally thought?

:icon10:Thanks for the printouts

Good point, all those points. Are you referring to the canister located by the battery or the reed valve closer the the head.

I've thought of that, but the fact of the matter here is that it lowered my temps at the head. Sorry about the pics every time i'm able to snap em', there has been poor lighting.

I googled the two sided spark plug and found very little about it. I did find a very cool thing to do to the spark plug in the mean-time.

There is something called "side chopping" to where you grind off a very small portion of the spark plug's "L"-shaped dealie enough to fully expose the electrode underneath (so that you can see it by looking at it from the bottom). Apparently they dont last as long, but they perform leaps and bounds past one that is not as well as keeping up with the irridiums. Keep it on the hush because apparently it is a well kept racing secret.
Enjoy

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Originally Posted by thedirtypickle

There is something called "side chopping" to where you grind off a very small portion of the spark plug's "L"-shaped dealie enough to fully expose the electrode underneath (so that you can see it by looking at it from the bottom). Apparently they dont last as long, but they perform leaps and bounds past one that is not as well as keeping up with the irridiums. Keep it on the hush because apparently it is a well kept racing secret.

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Very interesting! Could this be because the spark is more exposed inside the cylinder, rather than hidden underneath itself? What would cause it to perish faster? Actually, what does cause a spark plug to die, and how do you know when it's dead?

heat....a white plug has been overheated.

the only real accurate temp is at the oil, you got variables in reading off the head.

The air coming in now is cooler....but the combustion is hotter. You eliminated the EGR that feeds exhaust into the intake, that exhaust is oxygen depleted, less oxygen less heat. Its the core temp in the combustion that is primary, with the EGR that combustion temperature was reduced. Your now burning hotter across the range were as before you had the EGR's affect.

http://www.aa1car.com/library/reading_spark_plugs.jpg

I took some pictures of the EGR so people can see what it is.
http://i784.photobucket.com/albums/y...cture001-1.jpg
http://i784.photobucket.com/albums/y...cture002-1.jpg
http://i784.photobucket.com/albums/y...cture003-1.jpg
http://i784.photobucket.com/albums/y...cture004-1.jpg
http://i784.photobucket.com/albums/y...cture005-1.jpg
http://i784.photobucket.com/albums/y...cture006-1.jpg

I think mine is noisy, I can tell when its open and when it trying to close, it makes a wapping sound.

your sprak plug should just be cleaned and regapped every once in a while. I've never had to do that for any bikes I've had yet.

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heat....a white plug has been overheated.

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I understand that it is heat, But have you seen a plug with a very normal colored side with a greyish/whitish side. Think of it like two-face from the new batman movie.

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The air coming in now is cooler....but the combustion is hotter. You eliminated the EGR that feeds exhaust into the intake, that exhaust is oxygen depleted, less oxygen less heat. Its the core temp in the combustion that is primary, with the EGR that combustion temperature was reduced. Your now burning hotter across the range were as before you had the EGR's affect.

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This system is, and was, doing so very little than just capping off the hole to where it was reintroducing exhaust would create the same effect. Think about it, if it was pooping hot fumes in a regular fashion, it would be blazin hot and melt everything in the airbox. I dont know why, but my results were better than stock, heat-wise, and the damn thing is a wart on the side of this machine. When I shut her down, it raises about 10deg at the head then drops from there never getting above 214deg at most where as before it would hop up to around 230-240deg. Those are real temp measurements from a point on the head.

I love all this feedback. I think its because I'm surrounded by hillbillies that like to hunt and old people that love to read or listen to their elvis records. I dont get any tech talk... neeed it!

Thanks for your time,
Greg

I’m not a physicist, the combustion has peak temperatures and they occur at some point? Mixing air and fuel has some peak point in derived combustion temperatures. This device prevents that from occurring, it is timed or configured to open when that occurs typically. Adding the exhaust gas will do that, but seeing that Nitrous oxide production occurs at 2500 degrees really confuses me, that must be an internal flash temperature potential? Seems very high to me. Adding exhaust to the air keeps that from occurring that peak flash temperature in the combustion chamber.

The EGR opens and closes, its not always open but must be opening in a range that has the highest potential for that highest peak combustion temperature. So you never get to that peak with it operating correctly.

Now it is gone and you have an over all lower temperature on the head? But inside the engine you now have these flash points that are higher.

Man you have a lower average temp but you now have these peaks. The fuel to air mix and firing timing? The same as before in some of the range but in other parts of the throttle range you now do not have the EGR effect. Your getting these flash points that are hotter and that could be affecting the plug.

How does the time of firing work on these bikes, is it electronic? Its not fuel injected its mechanical so in some instances the fuel to air mix and firing is not correct. That would be the range that the EGR was in effect. I am not taking mine off because I cannot ignore that that bikes configuration is set for it to be there. A bike that did not have one from the factory would help, how is set up? Is the timing preset in the CDI or can it be adjusted? The carburetor may need adjusting to or in the range that the EGR operates, when is it open and when is it closed? Which jet is in effect in that range.

A white plug is a sign of the fuel to air mix being off or the ignition timing. Maybe I am wrong but it is currently configured for the EGR being there.

Everything has a range, it has high points and low points setting are configured to accommodate the range.

Put the EGR back on and then put in a new plug, then check the plug. Process of elimination if that has an effect on the plug then what is different and why.

I think the EGR opens in the midrange…..it not open at idle and closes at upper range to full throttle I believe. Other removed that device but they also added performance exhaust and increase the jet sizes? They may have set it better to operate without that device by doing that?

The half color is a sign of an uneven ignition and all related to fuel to air and timing. The EGR is integral in that….

You sound very knowlegable MJH, and I wasn't trying to down you man. Your probly right.

UPDATE:
I just installed a larger main jet of 127.5 and wowsers. This bike is the bees-knees after that. The two sided plug color has mostly gone away and is showing very nice color now (greyish/light-brown). I've seen other threads that are talking about the needed up-jet from stock and boy-o-boy were they right. If I were to say so, it had to have givin and extra 2-3hp gain. It's quite substantial, and I highly recommend the 127.5 jet.

One more thing, I'm retracting taking that canister by the battery off. Reason being that when you are putting along and you dont have a full tank of gas there seems to be negetive pressure in the gas tank causing you to sputter to a stop. Fixed of coarse by opening the gas cap and continuing on your way. I suppose you could leave the hose going to the tank open, but you may get some spillage from time to time. No Biggie, but keep it in mind.

I'm currently hunting for pooper pipes and found a few on ebay, but sadly winter is comming and I dont have much more time to ride here in minnesota. :(

You know MJH, come to think of it, I was blowing in the little unit and if I remember right, I thought it was only able to suck air in to the engine and not push exhaust into the air box. I've thrown mine away, so I cant check. It is, in fact, how scooter's systems work. They had the same kind of unit that ONLY injected air into the exhaust stream in the attempt to have "cleaner" emmisions.

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Originally Posted by thedirtypickle

You sound very knowlegable MJH, and I wasn't trying to down you man. Your probly right.

UPDATE:
I just installed a larger main jet of 127.5 and wowsers. This bike is the bees-knees after that. The two sided plug color has mostly gone away and is showing very nice color now (greyish/light-brown). I've seen other threads that are talking about the needed up-jet from stock and boy-o-boy were they right. If I were to say so, it had to have givin and extra 2-3hp gain. It's quite substantial, and I highly recommend the 127.5 jet.


One more thing, I'm retracting taking that canister by the battery off. Reason being that when you are putting along and you dont have a full tank of gas there seems to be negetive pressure in the gas tank causing you to sputter to a stop. Fixed of coarse by opening the gas cap and continuing on your way. I suppose you could leave the hose going to the tank open, but you may get some spillage from time to time. No Biggie, but keep it in mind.

I'm currently hunting for pooper pipes and found a few on ebay, but sadly winter is comming and I dont have much more time to ride here in minnesota. :(

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well there you go...I think that the 127.5 had no advantage over the 125 it offered no additional hp? But the DYNO test included a performance pipe and resulted in 19.4hp?

It was with a main jet from 122.5 to 125 and the slow jet from 32.5 to 35.

I will be looking at exhausts this fall....a local manufacturer HMF I want it to look stock. Flat black with a polished tip, I also want it to have the same mounting points. I want a very good muffler...that is made of good material. Here is their website: http://hmfracing.com/

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Originally Posted by thedirtypickle

You know MJH, come to think of it, I was blowing in the little unit and if I remember right, I thought it was only able to suck air in to the engine and not push exhaust into the air box. I've thrown mine away, so I cant check. It is, in fact, how scooter's systems work. They had the same kind of unit that ONLY injected air into the exhaust stream in the attempt to have "cleaner" emmisions.

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EGR devices are on cars also they are a reed valve they open with vacuum off the carburetor.
http://www.asashop.org/autoinc/nov97/gas.htm

I will say that those HMF pipes are pretty.

I agree with you what an EGR system is, and all i'm saying is that it drew air into the engine from the airbox. I have three chinese 50cc scooters and they have the same type of setup to where they...

You know what? this thread is getting nowhere... Your right... EGR blah blah blah

::Thread closed::

I agree it got boring...but at least people now can understand what the heck it actually is and what the heck it actually does. Maybe? LOL

Actually it was interesting and slightly amusing too, thanks! Most here just watch and don't reply unless directly interested.

Not to beat a dead horse, but I found out that the little box that we were calling an EGR is only an air injection system. All it does is inject extra air into the exhaust to create the appearance of lower emissions (less carbons per unit). It's not an EGR people, they call it something along the lines of "secondary air intake".

Is it a PAIR (Pulse Air Injection Reaction)
http://www.home.roadrunner.com/%7Eea...ons_system.jpg