Have grown longer legs in the last few days so all fine now :riding:Quote:
Originally Posted by culcune
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Have grown longer legs in the last few days so all fine now :riding:Quote:
Originally Posted by culcune
Wald0, yeah sure the setup I got is fugly,no doubt about that. But this is by far not the final one. I am just trying to figure out what works and what doesn't. The rack you posted looks good, but yeah the boxes are expensive...
prince666, I have already ordered a no-name Chinese top box from taobao that is like twice the size of the one I got. I will install that one, remove the sidebars and see if it will suffice.
Right. So this is the third attempt at putting some storage space onto my bike. This time I removed the sidebags and installed a new topbox from taobao.
Link: http://item.taobao.com/item.htm?spm=...id=37031812894
The topbox naturally comes with a mounting plate and bolts to mount it to your luggage rack.
Yes, it looks big and heavy and all that, but it allows me to have no sidebags, thusly clearing the blinkers. And it holds rain gear and a full-face helmet and my gloves when parked, or raingear, my backpack and a lock when riding. I can surely put in all the books, handouts, copied material and teaching stuff in and still have place for more. Overall I am happy with it for now.
Attachment 15474 Attachment 15476
Attachment 15475 Attachment 15477
The bike still keeps on throwing red light (ignition???) error codes, but I have no time to take the bike to the dealer (whom I don't really trust). So far, it runs fine both below and above 6000 rpm, thusly no rush to deal with that.
Thinking about getting a new chain and a set of tires after my biannual bike check this September.
Well done Steve that's what i call a good size top box :thumbsup:
prince 666, yes, as I said, I am happy with it for now. Apparently it doesn't look like it belongs on the bike, but again it was one-hundred-something yuan, which beats Givi and Shad. I'll be riding with this setup for now - will see if it affects handling anyhow, if it is waterproof and all that.
I would ideally have side boxes on a rigid frame, but those are expensive and add to the bike width, which is not good for filtering.
Had over 20 kg in the GIVI box on a bike
Which is only 123 kg and was fine. It does
Help abit IMO I found with the top box and
A few kg in puts a bit of weight over the back Wheel
The GIVI was not to bad on cost 400
Rmb but got it in Thailand .
400 for a Givi box is a reasonable price! I'd be happy to pay it. Yes, there is a certain feeling that the balance is different, nothing extraordinary though.
Yesterday removed the seat, unplugged the ECU, waited for about 10 min and plugged it back - surprise-surprise, nothing happened. The red ignition warning light kept on blinking out errors. The new 650 NK ECU is 2224 yuan or so from the official TMall CFMoto store.
Right.
Start the bike today in the morning - no problem. No flashing lights, no warnings, nothing. WTF?
Mine started flashing the ECU short circuit code a few weeks after buying the bike. Was worried at first and reset the ECU a couple of time. Now, I just ignore it.
Apparently, it is a common problem on the bike. From a web search, I read that even after buying a new ECU, the bike will still have the problem.
OK, so I got my ECU. I swapped the old one for the new one in less than 5 min, and, voila - everything works as it should: no warning lights, no spluttering engine, no nothing.
Good.
Forgot to post that before actually sending me the goods, the sales guy / girl asked me for my bike production date. I sent him that together with the VIN and engine number just so as to be on the safe side. It looks like there have been different generations in ECU firmware and the one I got was plain buggy. But this is just my guess.
I do hope that the new ECU works well and brings me no trouble.
Should it malfunction again, I will sell the bike in a flash and hold a very negative opinion of CFMoto's electrical components R&D and QC (as if CFMoto cares about my opinion, aha...). I cannot afford dropping another 2.5K on a bike every now and then.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve_Halt
Great! im in the same boat also.. :/ my bike sputter at 4-5000 rpm range.. and the culprit it the :gun_bandana:ECU!! There is also different throttle bodies out there.. with holes in the butterfly valves and without.
So im in the same boat also now.. need New :gun_bandana: ECU!! There is also different throttle bodies out there, with and without hole in the butterfly valves. this hole thing must be new bike.Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve_Halt
Wald0, most likely this is an upgrade for the 2014 model. But again, I am just guessing. The original engine seems to be almost identical to ER-6N's, so probably Chinese R&D and upgrade isn't much of a positive thing...
I've been riding with a flashing warning light for more than half a year - first it didn't influence the riding experience anyhow, but then the bike started behaving strangely, and only then did I decide to change it.
Yes, mine will not even throw any errors at all, I Had airleak in my throttle bodies butterfly shaft and replaced it with new throttle body and it had those holes.. they say ECU should be re programmed if done that., but i have not seen any differences in performance. until this ECU went bad.. :(
The hole in the butterfly valves is meaningless. Both work off the same ECU. My TPS went in the first few weeks, I was able to source 2 different throttle bodies under warranty both in 2013 one with hole one without (as the TPS as not sold as a separate part, but is included with the throttle bodies). It's just a different way of solving the same problem at idle. Either the throttle body is a little open to let some mix through or it goes through the hole. I researched it because I was thinking about changing the bodies if one was superior to the other.
I'm sure the ECU is the culprit. I also don't massively blame CFMOTO in this case as the ECU/throttle bodies/injectors/sensors are from Ducati/Dekra/Magnetti Magnelli. I reckon the old equipment has some issues, but I still worry about longer term reliability. Still considering who made the electronics, its got to be less of a worry than a if it was directly made by a Chinese motorcycle company.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZMC888
Sure, can't blame Chinese all the time... or can you?? where was those components made?? china?? ;)
first Ducati's where infamous of their electrical problems.. and ou yes... they were italians... ! bike made in china with Italian electronics.. we are so screwed! :diggin: fingers crossed boys! haha ;)
Hang on! The hugely reliable GW250, YBR 125, YBR250 and CBF150 are made in China....see Chinese can do it right when they have a Japanese management structure!Quote:
Originally Posted by Wald0
Dekra are a massive company. Watch F1 and I'm sure you'll see their logos on a few billboards and cars. OK, yes the stuff is made in Shenzhen China. But hold out some hope..................:mwink:
Wald0, ZMC888, I read through your threads on 650 NK and got a lot of useful info. Thanks for sharing :)
So far, the new ECU has been ok, BUT ... [drumroll] ... after installing it, my bike's idle has been fluctuating between 2000 and 2500 rpm. I believe it is unnatural. Question: is there any way to manually adjust idle on an EFI engine, like you would do it on a carburetted one?
If not (and I assume not, since it is ECU and a massive amount of sensors responsible for ice adjustment), any ideas as to what I am supposed to do with that? The bike seems to run hotter than usual, and the ten gauge reaches 4-5 bars when sitting in traffic.
Idle with the previous ECU was a steady 1500 rpm...
My friend and I have both got the same bike, so I have a fairly clear understanding of what the bike should be doing and what is normal. 3 bars of heat and 1500 rpm, as you suspect is normal. 4-5 bars of heat and 2500 rpm is absolutely not correct. I think EFI bikes do often have idle adjust screws, but I haven't heard of one on our bike.Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve_Halt
Is your fan coming on within 5 minutes of starting the bike?
I would certianly check the air filter/fuel/plugs.
I would certainly check the ECU connector, as this is known to be cheap and cause some errors. Clean the connector with alcohol and a q-tip. I reckon the ECU is runniong errors and needs a look at, however as we can't do it, have a look at what we can do. Hot and high idle sounds too lean.
ZMC888, no the fan doesn't come on that fast. The bike's air filter and plugs were changed march this year, all bought from the official CFMoto TMall store. Fuel is #95 gas.
The idle RPM is not fluctuating any more, sitting steadily at 2000 and giving me 3-4 bars of heat when riding in downtown traffic. I've noticed my single cylinder EFI Suzuki EN-150 also has 2000 RPM idle and it does feel comfortable and sound OK, unlike 650 NK...
Will clean the ECU connector tonight.
Besides idling at very high RPM, the new ECU brought another problem: delayed throttle response. Both from roll-on or from standstill, when opening the throttle there is a delay in engine response.
It is pretty hard to describe, but it feels like: open throttle - engine bogs down - and - go!
As everybody understands, that results in pretty much uncontrollable acceleration, since you never know how long it's going to take for that "go" to kick in.
What worsens the problem is that I don't really know much about electrics / electronics. That means I cannot sort it out myself. My option is to either continue buying those "electrical black boxes" and hoping that a certain combination of those will finally work or to ditch this bike and go for something else. Ditching a bike would be a regret since I have it plated, registered in my name, and I have insurance on it.
I have a gut feeling that this problem may be related to TPS, but, as ZMC888 pointed out, it is not sold separately, which leaves me with no choice but to buy the whole throttle assembly (800-something yuan), which is not what I want to do.
Now what I got on my hands are 2 ECUs:
1. Came with the bike, throws errors, engine has a flat spot (bogging down) anywhere between 4000 and 6000 RPM. But has proper idle and immediate throttle response.
2. The one I bought from the CFMoto Tmall store. This one doesn't throw errors, has smooth response through the RPM range, but makes the engine idle at crazy high RPM and has a significant throttle response delay.
I am very disappointed.
Just eliminate everything else before you go spending money.
If it were my bike I'd:
-Send the 'new' ECU back to CFMOTO and ask for a different one, tell them it's faulty. If the old one works badly then the new one should fix the errors. My suspicion is after 12 years in China that they've either knowingly (likely thinking they're doing the right thing for their millionaire overlords as the consumer should not complain in China) or unknowingly (possible) sold you a duff ECU. Could you try one from another bike? If not then....
-Check plugs
-Check fuel quality
-Check air filter
-try injector cleaner
-try a different TPS from another bike
-find a really unusually good bike mechanic that has their own shop and good attitude (good tools and plenty of customers with big bikes should be the guide)
There's really no point in thinking about selling at this stage, as having a bike that's running poorly is hardly going to sell well. If you decide to sell the bike, for sake of your bank balance try to get these problems sorted first.
I have a feeling it is the TPS, but not that it is broken.. let me as one question? Did you reset TPS after changing different ECU? as this should be done after you change ECU or TPS. if you did take your bike to dealer they should have done it for you! My problem is that my closest machine to reset TPS is about 1600km away.
Then getting back to symptoms.. I have that same "wall" what bike hits! it needs more gas to overcome that barrier, for me it feels like ignition timing is not changing as it should.
I suspect the symptoms MIGHT be related to the throttle bodies needing to be synchronised and/or the new/replacement EMU/ECM needing to be calibrated using the plug in diagnostic module. My 650TR idles round 1000-1200 RPM when engine is up to ideal operating temp, 3 bars on the temp LCD and no significant concern with operation of the cooling fan AFAIK.
YMMV
General directions to reset TPS/ISC on many EFI MC's...
1. Put the side stand up and engine stop switch is at “RUN”.
2. Turn the key to the "OFF" position.
3. Fully open the throttle/wide open throttle (WOT).
4. Turn the key to the "ON" position.
5. Release the throttle after waiting for eight seconds, or until red EFI light goes off.
6. Turn the key to the "OFF" position.
7. Turn the key to the "ON" position.
8. TPS and ISC have been reset successfully.
If the procedure fails, repeat the steps from 1 to 8.
Spot on from Waldo, do a TPS reset and problem should be solved.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wald0
Out of sync. injection creeps slowly, not from one day to the other.
998 and Wald0, should he do the same thing as reset ECU?
Or is there a different sequence to reset the TPS that only the factory might be aware of such as adjusting TPS voltage?
Or is there some plug in system?
Can the bike's ECU eventually adapt without doing a TPS reset?
So there must be a different ECU tune map in the new ECU?
Many questions............:thumbsup:
I know of some bikes where you can reset the TPS by itself, but I guess most bikes need software from the dealer since manufacturers realized that generates more money...Quote:
Originally Posted by ZMC888
It is mostly a check / adjustment on the mechanical parts (so that everything is set where it should), then a push on a button within the software to re-calibrate the TPS position against those mechanical settings.
A bike will NOT adapt if you do not perform a reset.
What you do by re-setting (or re-calibrating) is to give the ECU the (mechanical) reference point for the fuel map. If not re-set, it will use the wrong part of the curve or matrix forever.
Hence the higher idle and the stumble.
If a bike has 'self learning' software, it might compensate by changing the fuel mixture.
But even if that does, it is only compensating for a basis error, it is slow and retard, so you never use the optimum mixture, and it has its limits to compensate, so it might not cover the "out of wack" setting of the TPS completely.
E.
PS. I can hardly imagine that a dealer should not have the software, even in CN.
I thought the Jialing stalling problems were long time past.
ZMC888, Wald0, bikerdoc, 998S - guys thanks a lot for the input, much appreciated. In fact I learned a lot.
So to sum up: there is nothing wrong with the new ECU, but my TPS needs resetting so as to work with it properly.
Well, I have only one question here:
1. How do I reset TPS? (I know, ZMC888 asked already, but still...)
Is it some ignition - throttle - kill switch sequence that I can perform myself, or do I need specific equipment for it?
Thank you!Quote:
Originally Posted by 998S
So tomorrow I will ride to the CFMoto shop I got the bike from and ask them for a TPS reset (节气门传感器重新调整). Good if they have the software to do it. If not - I am pretty much stuck.
Thanks Eric! :thumbsup:Quote:
Originally Posted by 998S
I'm absolutely sure that my local dealerships would have utterly no clue about how to reset a TPS or any software or computer to be able to do it. :lol8:
My local dealership mechanic would...........
Scratch head, pick nose, start bike rev engine and say 'no problem'. Chinese mechanic translation 'no problem' = 'I don't have the parts, tools, experience or knowledge to fix this, and I'm trying to save face'.