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BigD, are you in China now? It sometimes sounds like you're in Ozzie land, and other times like you're in China...ChongQing?Quote:
Originally Posted by chinabiker
Anyway the GS1200 is not a sand rally machine but made for long distance all-terrain touring. Although I'm sure there are some people who can do amazing things with them, it's weight and girth pretty much precludes it from running with the smaller zippier unladen bikes up dunes.
CC
The 1200 GS is a great bike, a road bike in fact is really what it is.
When you look at all the roads in the world and look at how they really are, not how people would actually like them to be, (smooth flat bitumen). You soon realize that in developing countries lots of roads are bumpy and nasty dirt tracks. If you need to go a long way on them the beemer is the right tool.
Also 75 KW is more than enough power for me, aint no slug!
The BMW is perfect for really shitty roads, not real off-road because it's too heavy. China has plenty of shitty roads where the BMW is a great bike to have.
http://www.bikez.com/pictures/honda/...0-%20Honda.jpg
If I was going to do real off road, I'd have a 250 like this made for that purpose, if it gets stuck in a muddy bog you can pull it out by hand on your own, and you don't need a support crew with a 4X4 and a winch.
Or if I was going to go further maybe the 450 version of the CRF.
http://www.bikez.com/pictures/harley...Breivikaas.jpg
A traditional Harley (1340 Tour Glide Ultra Classic) is a pointless overweight slug (45 KW 366KG dry!!!!) , not a beemer!
I know this guy, Andy.
A) He can ride- Any where any terrain. He's the only foreigner I know that teaches the Chinese motorcycle cops how to ride.
B) His bike can do just about anything. I've also seen it.
Regds,
Jim
Really? He really teaches Chinese cops to ride? I've lived in China about six and a half years and culturally (where I am at least) Chinese have too big egos to ever learn anything from a foreigner unless they are learning:
1. English (and some of the time they don't believe what a foreigner is saying can be right if it contradicts their Chinese Uni English teacher!)
By pure maths, no matter how many Chinese motorcycle cops there are who completely suck, there will eventually be one who can really ride who will eventually get the the position of a teacher. Thus meaning that they never need a foreign teacher and save face.
Actually I've never seen a Chinese rider with his knee-down or with good road craft. But you'd find that they wouldn't want to learn that anyway. Probably they consider good to be going through small gaps and wheelies, endos and burnouts.
Perhaps if you sent them to BMW in Germany, to do a proper training course that could be different, or sent them to learn from motorcycle cops in a developed country, such as the UK, USA or Australia they could handle it.
Anyway what training do Chinese motorcycle cops need?
1. Park on intersection.
2. Collect cash from motorists.
Not much riding involved!
Indeed, I do train Chinese Police riders of cities where they got the new BMW R1200RT (authorities spec.).Quote:
Originally Posted by ZMC888
That's BS. Believe it or not, they request a foreign instructor and are very happy about it.Quote:
Originally Posted by ZMC888
We're holding our sessions in an amicable, non-arrogant way, respect each other and besides improving their skills we always have good fun.
There are some racing and practice events on the Golden port race track in Beijing, Tianma circuit in Shanghai as well as in Zhuhai and there are more over the country, I'm sure - knees down all over the place.Quote:
Originally Posted by ZMC888
Knee sliding btw is not suitable in public traffic for 70+ reasons and I personally know more than a dozen of very skilled Chinese riders on big beasts, most of them being trained by BMW in Germany.
They all come from max 250cc bikes and need to get used to handle the 300+ kg high-tech piece of a bike, particularly in low speed situations.Quote:
Originally Posted by ZMC888
Moreover, there are many basic (to us) things about motorcycle riding, which they never hear of before.
Finally some picture proof - Nanning, June 2008
I'd like to take this opportunity to express my gratitude to Nanning traffic police for their perfect arrangement and great hospitality.
Thank You Guys!
http://photos.imageevent.com/chinabi...0531150253.jpg
http://photos.imageevent.com/chinabi...0601095312.jpg
http://photos.imageevent.com/chinabi...0531162413.jpg
http://photos.imageevent.com/chinabi...0531233656.jpg
Andy
P.S. I am holding a BMW Motorrad Instructor license, which entitles me to hold "On-road Safety Riding" as well as "Enduro" trainings in the name and on behalf of BMW Motorrad and BMW Rider Training.
epic response.
What I said was:Quote:
I am holding a BMW Motorrad Instructor license, which entitles me to hold "On-road Safety Riding" as well as "Enduro" trainings in the name and on behalf of BMW Motorrad and BMW Rider Training.
ie. if the training was official, they could hack the loss of face. You are doing what BMW would have done for them in Germany, only without leaving China. I thought it was a case of 'random foreigner teaches Chinese cops a thing or two', clearly not the case.Quote:
Perhaps if you sent them to BMW in Germany, to do a proper training course that could be different, or sent them to learn from motorcycle cops in a developed country, such as the UK, USA or Australia they could handle it.
I realize that of course, but it should be a skill that they are capable of away from the city streets. I wouldn't want to see a Chinese cop riding through a city centre with his knee down on a BMW! :eekers:Quote:
Knee sliding btw is not suitable in public traffic for 70+ reasons and I personally know more than a dozen of very skilled Chinese riders on big beasts, most of them being trained by BMW in Germany.
Anyway what training do Chinese motorcycle cops need?
1. Park on intersection.
2. Collect cash from motorists.
3. Gain 'face' from having big huge BMW motorcycles they don't really need, that they won't allow other people to own.
ZMC,
Although bikes of that size in China do seem a little over the edge considering the traffic density, speeds and general road conditions I don't see why they shouldn't want to have their piece of the pie too.
Of all the foreign bike manufs, BMW and Harley are the two spending the most time developing their brands, products and riding philosophy in China which is, as we all know, a massive potential market. Let's hope these two companies use their pull and resources to make riding easier and more legally friendly.
I'm extremely happy, surprised and impressed that Andy has had a chance to give these guys some proper training and that respect was shown in both directions. At the end of the day, anyone who wants to ride a bike as big and capable as those R's would need some training not only to be basically proficient with the machine but really be able to enjoy it.
I'm sure we'd all love to hear more about the program and if there's a way some of the mainland members of MCM could attend! Maybe an MCM Riding and Wrenching Clinic? :icon10:
Hats off Andy! :thumbsup:
CC
Carl,
I was totally owned in that post by Andy. But you have to admit he's one in 1.5 billion!
It all points in the right direction, I agree, no matter how impractical those bikes are for what a normal Chinese motorcycle cop might do (I have it on good authority those bikes are not being used for normal police at intersection duties), at least someone is being allowed to improve the standards, which will probably filter through to the rest of the population.
You never know, one day a cop here might see an experienced foreigner riding and just give you a knowing smile!
Yes I eat humble pie, kudos to Andy!
Now where is that damn advanced car instructor?!!
Yeah, no kidding. I think it was because the cops bought BMW bikes and that was part of the deal. But this guy can really ride that big heavy GS anywhere on any terrain.
You been down in Zibo too long. (I was there back in the 1980s) Up here in Beijing you can see some really good Chinese motorcyclists dragging their knees at GoldenPort race track on the track days.
Regds,
Jim
www.mycj750.com
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZMC888
I know that now! But what were the chances?Quote:
Yeah, no kidding. I think it was because the cops bought BMW bikes and that was part of the deal. But this guy can really ride that big heavy GS anywhere on any terrain.
I know but can't leave, (wife and baby).Quote:
You been down in Zibo too long.
Well, I hope they don't ride to the track, 'cos that would be illegal (unless they are very rich!).Quote:
Up here in Beijing you can see some really good Chinese motorcyclists dragging their knees at GoldenPort race track on the track days.
What bikes are they riding, by the way?
Goldenport is a nice circuit layout, has it been resurfaced recently, and is the track in good condition?
Cheers,
Lew
Oh, and do you know how much it costs to do a track day? And when they do them?
Thanks Jimbo!
Lat I heard I think it was about RMB 500 for a couple hours of tracktime. Mostly I see Hondas up to 1000ccs, Suzukis, a Ducati once in a while, and Yamahas. You need to hook up with one of 2 shops that are near the track. They get the call when the track is available and they SMS all their friends about it. You rarely get 24 hours notice I think.
I used to instruct for the Ferrari distributor there, and it was the same issue. The track is booked almost a year in advance so the only time available is when someone cancels.
Regds,
Jim
Oh, and do you know how much it costs to do a track day? And when they do them?
Thanks Jimbo![/QUOTE]
They had a lot of track days available in 2008, relative to the last few years . I'll bet there were at least ten (10) to fourtenn (14) , and that is about 10 to 14 more than I am aware of them having in years
Track Time = 180 RMB/ hour, to rent a Yamaha R-6 , appiox 650 RMB / hour