I didn't see you...or how a U-turner got me...

Another point I would like to make, myself coming from a scooter/bicycle before my JH600 is not being used to having a foot-brake on a 2-wheeled vehicle at first. Which at the start might result in pulling the clutch + front brake. However, now I always use my rear brake under normal circumstances.

Since you guys always advise to make pictures, I would like to add something: make pictures of any parts/pieces that came off of your and the other persons vehicle. Since normally most of the part/pieces will be on the side of the road or lane where the collision occured, these parts can be crucial to prove that the opposite party was on the wrong side of the road (your side of the road). So don't let anyone pick up/move any parts before pictures have been taken, make pictures that clearly show what side of the road all the bits and pieces are!

Hi there, thanks for the many thoughts on breaking strategy.

I am more on the rear side when it comes to breaking. I use the rear brake on open roads and the front brake most of the time only when I am in the city (and that is probably why I became so anal about my messed up rear disk). Maybe that is a relict from my mountain biking times. We used to say it is better to get off the bike below the bike (lowsider, mostly happens from rear brake faults) rather than over the handelbar (highsider, most common after too strong front-breaking). That said, I know that MC brakes are much smother to operate than the mountain bike brakes we had back then and that I am loosing out on braking power in general.

I will have to work on a better mix between f/r braking...

Fahni, your post about mountain bikes made me think about one important precision :
Use mainly your front brake on asphalt, but use mainly your rear brake on dirt !

Of course on mountain bikes or dirt bikes you'll be taught to use mainly the rear brake to avoid washing out the front.

I ride with my headlights on all the time, which is one of the reasons I have installed HID lighting on my rides and as brighter HID's as I can get here. I also like to wear a light coloured helmet and opted for a white coloured Jetmax in the end, even though I wanted a black one initially. My previous CF250T-Fashion VIP was also white. Unfortunately I had very limited choice for my Dragstar Classic, it only was available in black. Darker colours blend in more with the surroundings, while lighter/brighter colours stand out more. So if one is considering motorcycle clothing, helmets, motorcycle colours etc. opt for a lighter colour close to the whiter shades of the colour spectrum. Another thing I have done is applied a lot of extra reflective tape in strategic areas on my vehicles, some of this has been cut into customised shapes to blend in with lines and aesthetics of my motos. It might be of little use during the day but in dark situations it will present a larger identifiable profile to a light source ie. other vehicle user provided they have their headlights on.

I use my horn on all my vehicles in China with gusto, and it has saved me from the potential of accidents numerous times. I also ride/drive passive/aggressively even though I don't like it, it's the only way in China if one doesn't want to be pushed aside especially on a motorcycle. I also have replaced my horns on all vehicles with two tone type electronic air horns, that way others around me think they are dealing with something bigger or in the case where I might have been seen, they might think just for a moment that this motorcycle is not an ordinary motorcycle and they'd be right, and duly take a little more care/effort.

80-90% of a motorcycles braking force is achieved via the application of the front brakes, though initially one should also apply the rear brake which will apply a transfer of weight towards the front of the motorcycle, which in turn increases the amount of front tyre contact and applicable friction characteristics when the front brake is applied. Under emergency braking though, given humans innate flight/fight response it's better to focus on application of the front brakes and forget about the rear brake application altogether which most of us would tend to press down on too-hard in a panic with resultant rear wheel lock-up and consequence slide which is not good. Having the rear wheel turning also tends to provide more stability so without the application of the rear brake in emergency/panic braking on a motorcycle the continued momentum of the rear wheel will help keep the bike upright, with less likely hood of sliding sideways. Application of the clutch is something that should be done too, even though logic might suggest that one uses engine braking to assist in the emergency situation, this is not completely correct. Throttling off will provide some initial deceleration forces, but only momentarily, after a short period though the engine will then resist deceleration, which means that application of the brakes is fighting against this force too.

Tips for braking on a motorcycle
Motorcycle braking and skid marks

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Originally Posted by Fred

Fahni, your post about mountain bikes made me think about one important precision :
Use mainly your front brake on asphalt, but use mainly your rear brake on dirt !

Of course on mountain bikes or dirt bikes you'll be taught to use mainly the rear brake to avoid washing out the front.

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I always use at least 90% front brake while riding my dirt bike probably 80% on my MTB(I rear brake slide into corners more on the MTB) the only time I use the back brake more would be on steep technical descents on the dirt.If it is too steep I will get off and bull dog it down using the clutch and front brake engine off to control it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Fred

First : I never said that my "technique" is the best, far from it, and I know perfectly well that the braking is much more effective when using both brakes (75% front, 25% rear). I tested it times and times again and clearly the braking is really more efficient than braking only from the front.

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That's pretty much right as a general rule on tarmac in the dry! Just dodgy conditions alter it to 50-50, but that's a progressive (squeeze) application of the brakes.

Really nothing teaches you more about using the front brake than learning to endo (stoppie). Nothing teaches you more about using the rear brake than tail sides or drifts. Nothing teaches you more about throttle use and rear brake modulation than wheelieing. Nothing teaches you more about cornering than learning to knee-down (or bar down with dirt bikes/MTB). Despite how pointless these tricks are on their own.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ZMC888

Really nothing teaches you more about using the front brake than learning to endo (stoppie). Nothing teaches you more about using the rear brake than tail sides or drifts. Nothing teaches you more about throttle use and rear brake modulation than wheelieing. Nothing teaches you more about cornering than learning to knee-down (or bar down with dirt bikes/MTB). Despite how pointless these tricks are on their own.

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:thumbsup:Will do as you say and spend more times on whellies, stoppies, etc.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by fahni

:thumbsup:Will do as you say and spend more times on whellies, stoppies, etc.

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Although in this cold weather we have in northern China, learning some of these skills on a mountain bike (bicycle) is very cheap and healthy! There's nothing better than starting the new motorcycle riding season with new skills in the spring.

Hi Fred, sorry to hear about your mishap and good that you are ok - would have been funny to see you running :lol8:


Sorry to chime in - as an instructor I couldn't resist when I read the "braking" news.

When it comes to emergency braking, as it had in Fred's case, generally the following shall be done:

1. disengage clutch, close throttle
2. only slightly apply rear brake (to reduce the momentum of the spinning wheel and to stabilize the rear end)
3. firmly apply front brake and increase / decrease force; avoid locking up the wheel though
4. shift your weight back in order to avoid your arms to straighten
5. keep viewing towards the obstacle

If you ride a ABS equipped bike, fully apply both brakes.

As soon as you notice that a collision cannot be avoided, disengage both brakes and veer off to the side you think you can pass the obstacle by counter-steering.

Sounds complicated but isn't. After a bit of practice, the above 5 steps will become one. First, practice braking to standstill and when you think you are firm, try the collision avoiding maneuver.


Fred, not that I want be the smart ass :rolleyes1:, but from your description (the spot you hit that car), I'm pretty sure you could have avoided the collision with a bit of practice of the above.

Generally the front brake is the more effective brake. Different types of bike constructions have different brake efficiency - front / rear, which is approx. as follows.

heavy cruisers and choppers 50 / 50
cruisers 60 / 40
dual sports 70 / 30
sports bikes 80 / 20


Safe :riding:

Glad to hear your fine and unhurt! I am a new Motorcylist (Is that correct?) and I have been driving cars and trucks for over 21 years. I have always GREATLY respected Motorcyclist because of the limited protection afforded them, and now I have joined the ranks of the risky! I went today and got my insurance, and I am now waiting on my bill of sale and Origin of Manufacture so I can get my plate. I have NEVER driven a motorcycle EVER before now, so I am going to take a safety course and practice on my street that has VERY little traffic. I am not going to lie at all....I was very scared my first time behind the bars (is that right, or do we say wheel?) and I had a crowd of people watching me! No pressure, right? Anyway, here I am, learning from you all and hoping we all can move along from day to day and not get hurt (or worse) having fun on our bikes! I gotta say up front....I LOVE riding my Chopper!! I haven't gone fast on it, about 30mph/48kmh so far. I wear a helmet and hang on for life!!! Thanks for your post and lesson. I will DEFINATELY be watchful when I hit the roads! By the way, I have a DongFang DF250CHA with a 250cc engine.