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1 Attachment(s)
Re: Motorcycle Show Warsaw Poland 2015
Quote:
Originally Posted by
MJH
You are very observant, there are two sites one in Mandarin and one in English. The bikes are not the same on both.
Yes, yes.... I'm observant all over my body. :lol8:
No, I don't mean in that way - two versions of "Benda" site and two product ranges. Go to English version news section and find photos from 2013 Canton fair. First photo, behind a guy with a laptop, classic green bike with GS clone engine - that's one. Next photo, bottom left portion, also classic bike, but with CM clone (or maybe CB 125 T), twin engine. That's two. Same photo, center, this dark red bike with side bags. That's three. Next photo, second and third bike taken from different angle. All three bikes look to me quite decent.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
MJH
Here is the real deal...
The Benda takes allot of the design elements that make the Triumph Speed Triple unique.
Yes, they also took those ugly saucer-eyed headlights. Unfortunately. :puke:
What attracted my attention at first, are those "gills" under the tank and trelis swingarm, аnd only afterwards I noticed these elements borrowed from Triumph's bike.
I hope that we will see this, not prototype, but production bike, somewhere - Poland, Argentina, Russia... no matter where. It would be a pity if the bike remain forgotten. I don't like stillborn projects, especially if they are... glaring and unusual for C-moto industry.
Fingers crossed "Benda"!
And you too "Fekon" with your "Carlo" 250.
Attachment 16921
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Re: Motorcycle Show Warsaw Poland 2015
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Re: Motorcycle Show Warsaw Poland 2015
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Re: Motorcycle Show Warsaw Poland 2015
these people were at one time selling the twin above with a 125cc,
| 2,390.00 EUR |
= |
2,525.25 USD |
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Re: Motorcycle Show Warsaw Poland 2015
Looking at fottpegs position, rake angle, seat height and generally the whole geometry of the motorcycle, I concluded that this bike is neither American nor European form factor. It' is something in between - Atlantic bike. :icon10:
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Re: Motorcycle Show Warsaw Poland 2015
I was yesterday in a motorcycle shop in my city. There are standing 11 bikes of the 125ccm segment.
After this visit i know something more.
Barton TZ 125 WMI is LGV
Benyco BR 125 and Rapid WMI is LTZ.
Benyco Dark Star WMI is LBX.
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Re: Motorcycle Show Warsaw Poland 2015
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Zorge
Looking at fottpegs position, rake angle, seat height and generally the whole geometry of the motorcycle, I concluded that this bike is neither American nor European form factor. It' is something in between - Atlantic bike. :icon10:
They modified a Honda Rebel, they made it more horizontal. I do not like the seat or the rear fender.
if they went that far they should have went a bit further.
http://images.triumphmotorcycles.com...1706.png?w=600
http://i784.photobucket.com/albums/y...PA_chopper.jpg
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Re: Motorcycle Show Warsaw Poland 2015
Quote:
Originally Posted by
beniamin82
I was yesterday in a motorcycle shop in my city. There are standing 11 bikes of the 125ccm segment.
After this visit i know something more.
Barton TZ 125 WMI is LGV
Benyco BR 125 and Rapid WMI is LTZ.
Benyco Dark Star WMI is LBX.
Barton TZ 125 WMI is LGV (Heshan Guoji Nanlian Motorcycle Industry)
Benyco BR 125 and Rapid WMI is LTZ. (Foshan Nanhai Zhongmo Science & Tech)
Benyco Dark Star WMI is LBX.( KINROAD XINTIAN MOTORCYCLE MANUFACTURE CO., LTD
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Re: Motorcycle Show Warsaw Poland 2015
It is obvious who manufactures the Junak NK650…a real good article about CFMOTO
| 18,999.00 PLN |
= |
4,914.54 USD |
I am more then a casual observer and less then a total expert...that article is pretty spot on, with acceptation to the claim that CFMOTO does not sell as re-branded models in the global market, when in fact they do.
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Re: Motorcycle Show Warsaw Poland 2015
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Re: Motorcycle Show Warsaw Poland 2015
Japan Technology?
Same thing like with the cheap knives - they are all "Solingen Qualitat". :lol8:
BTW, this "Shineray" must be a motorcycle with the smallest brake disk in history.
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Re: Motorcycle Show Warsaw Poland 2015
You know, this "Shineray" is not bad purchase - only ~860 euros. Here, most afordable commuter bike is "Keeway Strike" 125, also with 125cc CG clone and skinny 18" tires - approx. 1050 euros.
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Re: Motorcycle Show Warsaw Poland 2015
what is up with Leonart?
They offer a Piaggio 125cc DOHC 4-valve? 15CV
but the price?
| 15,900.00 PLN |
= |
4,262.84 USD |
http://www.leonartmotors.com/fdaytona.html
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Re: Motorcycle Show Warsaw Poland 2015
All 125's with a good engine are extortionate my Rieju Spanish built but with Yamaha engine was equivelent to $4,900+/- and this was in 2011
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Re: Motorcycle Show Warsaw Poland 2015
Seems to me that KSR Moto should be partnering with one of these Polish companies.
The DOHC 125cc they have is under represented in the market. They need to get the sales up and in that get the prices down.
| 2,495.00 GBP |
= |
3,718.06 USD
|
http://autodaily.vn/wp-content/uploa...1/A0D_0986.jpg
KSR is not likely selling enough of these, Romet is bragging about market shares in the face of huge drops in overall sales. That is do to the market being saturated and also maturing. I believe that the 125cc that does not exceed 15hp is the L class limit. It is EFI and a modern design, it could be used in more designs and offered under other brand names. What engine will be in the Junak EVO 125?
I think it is too soon to get these current higher prices on these they need to be closer to 2700 EUR. They need more of a presence in the market, they are getting overlooked.
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Re: Motorcycle Show Warsaw Poland 2015
your looking at £1,995 without road charges on the Generic/KSR 125 supermoto whichis 2700+/- Euros
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Re: Motorcycle Show Warsaw Poland 2015
Another issue is that of QJ and it not recovering its investments, these 125cc are likely of Austrian design, however they are coming out of a Chinese factory for sure. This engine needs to be produced in higher volumes and that would be a matter of designing models that could host it.
What is the EVO and what is the evolution?
These multinationals need to get together in respect to channel marketing. It is possible to have identical products offered under different brands in different regions. It is also possible to have different designs that share common parts, like the engines.
For example: The EVO bikes from Junak could have a DOHC 125 and 250.
Then the same engines could be Benelli offerings.
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-NO_cuvS2T6...e-cylinder.jpg
Then the Junk EVO could also be a KSR in other markets, then maybe a WK in the UK…
Then the same engines could be used in 125cc and 250cc Motards…using different brand names in different markets.
One line Benelli and all the bikes that have that theme offered only under that brand name.
Then another line that shares engines from the 250cc DOHC down. Each having a differet brand name and specific regional partner. Then call these in-common shared designs QJ in china and keep the Benelli separate.
This should be offered only as a Benelli
http://a.mcdn.es/mnet/contents/media...pg/656x369cut/
If they had contractual partnerships for distribution then those partnerships could create designs that would be different to the well-established Benelli design theme QJ developed. It be a different theme and offer different designs consistently across all partnered national brand collectively for each region. In that the distribution partners could also sell Benelli and their own brand and benefit from a common source for parts. These new brands could be offered as QJ in China and clearly separate the design theme that is Benelli. That could result in the other larger displacement engines being introduced into new designs.
It also allows for a venue to sell all the common designs that are popular.
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Re: Motorcycle Show Warsaw Poland 2015
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Kennon
your looking at £1,995 without road charges on the Generic/KSR 125 supermoto whichis 2700+/- Euros
this is were I got the prices
http://www.motorcyclesupermarket.com...ingham-6186388
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Re: Motorcycle Show Warsaw Poland 2015
Quote:
Originally Posted by
MJH
What engine will be in the Junak EVO 125?
Well, when "Hanway Raw" became "Romet Ogar Caffe", he lost his cute "Yamaha" OHC engine and got "good, old CG clone"... No, no, better scratch "good". When "Mrs. Robinson" became "Junak 126", she lost hers CBB clone and got... take a gues... CG clone! So, "Junak" EVO 125 will get CG clone, maybe balanced, maybe liquid cooled, but still CG clone.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
MJH
Another issue is that of QJ and it not recovering its investments, these 125cc are likely of Austrian design, however they are coming out of a Chinese factory for sure. This engine needs to be produced in higher volumes and that would be a matter of designing models that could host it.
It appears to me that "Zong's" been doing exactly that with their ZS 177 MM engine - almost every month I see a new bike with that engine. It will not be long before we call him "Chinese engine mainstream". But I agree that modern, eco-friendly and fuel-efficient 125cc with up to 11 kW engine is a niche that is not filled. The European market can consume a lot of motorcycles with such engine.
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Romet Cafe is Dafier. I do not found any website. Maybe they copy hanway? And the engine is 154fmi OHV. This is very odd.
About junak Evo i.will have information in a week. There is a motorshow in poznań in Poland this weekend and i have there a spy...
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Re: Motorcycle Show Warsaw Poland 2015
Not necessarily. God knows who is who in Chinese motorcycle components industry. Аccording to an article which I read a few years ago, "modus operandi" of small Chinese factories is like that: first factory makes frames and swap them with another factory that makes wheels, then the third, which makes fuel tanks and plastic parts. I think you see my point.
German Wiki about Dafier-puffier:
Quote:
Die Jiangsu Dafier Motorcycle Co., Ltd. (Handelsmarke Dafier) ist ein chinesischer Motorradhersteller mit Sitz in Changzhou in der Provinz Jiangsu.
Das Unternehmen wurde im Jahr 2002 als Gemeinschaftsunternehmen mit der Qingqi-Gruppe gegründet. Das Kapital beträgt 200 Millionen Renminbi (rund 20 Mio. €), jährlich produziert die Firma 200.000 Motorräder, 100.000 Motoren und 300.000 Rahmen, Gussformen und Leuchten.
Für den europäischen Markt stellt Dafier Motorroller mit 50, 110 und 125 cm³ sowie Motorräder mit 125 cm³ her. Dabei handelt es sich vor allem um Fahrzeuge im unteren Preissegment, die mit den Modellen anderer Hersteller baugleich sind.
Looks like just one more assembly plant.
Why did they choose this OHV engine for "Ogar Caffe" or any other "reasonably priced" bike? Simply - because it was the cheapest. Here's a link for an article about "engine's mainstream" on Chinese motorcycles - http://moto-magazine.ru/technics/brand/parad_klonov/. Their prices were also mentioned.
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Re: Motorcycle Show Warsaw Poland 2015
I would have thought that The Romet CRS 125 was out of Hanway? Daifer is affiliated with Qingqi and so is Hanway. Also the Lexmoto LSM may have been out of Hanway? Both stopped selling them not sure why, Hanway is an OEM they make the bikes to customer specs. If Romet is buying them through Daifer they are sourced out of the same or even whatever production is available. Daifer is like a trading company.
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Re: Motorcycle Show Warsaw Poland 2015
I know Generic the Austrian brand at joint venture with QJ as QJ gets design input and help with engine development and with that Generic got a manufacturing facility to produce bikes for the EU
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1 Attachment(s)
Re: Motorcycle Show Warsaw Poland 2015
Quote:
Originally Posted by
MJH
I found a photo from ZIPP, is a OHV...
Attachment 17114
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Re: Motorcycle Show Warsaw Poland 2015
The NK 125 in the UK is sold as the AJS TN125 I've seen one so far not a bad looking bike,
http://www.ajsmotorcycles.co.uk/new_AJS/docs/main.htm
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Re: Motorcycle Show Warsaw Poland 2015
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Re: Motorcycle Show Warsaw Poland 2015
Quote:
Originally Posted by
MJH
It is difficult to tell who is the OEM for each, however if you have the VIN then not so hard.
The 127 IMO is made by
ZHEN
I have it in my garage till 20.08.15. According to WMI it is a Fosti (LB5)
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Re: Motorcycle Show Warsaw Poland 2015
Fosti and ZHEN are the same manufacturer, zhongneng
They are a very big exporter of scooters, allot of those scooters are design copies of other manufactures. They were thrown out of the Italian Trade show for bringing in copies. They are pretty well organized, but there is some questions about quality control, and allot of what they sell may look good cosmetically but is based on old technology and may not even be assembled very well. We know this because they sell boat loads of them in North America and it’s not hard to find owners with issues, such as excessive vibrations, overheating etc.
The model that you have is their DBR and it was intended to have the CB250 Zongshen engine, it has fatter tires on 17” rims and a mono shock rear suspension. With that configuration it be a decent budget bike, without the 17hp engine it would likely be less decent? The design of that model is their own, it’s not a copy of anything else directly.
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Re: Motorcycle Show Warsaw Poland 2015
Quote:
Originally Posted by
MJH
Leonart historically utilized Lifeng (Regal Raptor) as its OEM, they presented a model in 2012 they called a Pilder. An odd design with a single sided swing-arm and driven by a Piaggio DOHC water cooled 125cc.
http://i784.photobucket.com/albums/y...012a306069.jpg
