Soberpete's YBR 250

Here's one more bit of useful information about the BMW 650cc single that perhaps puts into context the skepticism of Heiri's BMW buddies about Loncin's manufacturing of the engine. According to this wikipedia entry, the 650 single engine indeed is assembled by Loncin with technology from Rotax of Austria, which had made the engines previously, and even the Loncin-manufactured engines contain some components provided by Rotax.

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2009: G650GS

In late 2008, BMW relaunched the original single-cylinder F650GS under the new name G650GS in the United States, South America, Greece[1] and Australia.[4][6] The new G650GS is essentially the 2007 single-cylinder F650GS brought back into production with some minor modifications and with the engine assembled by Loncin in China instead of Rotax in Austria, but still using parts manufactured by Rotax in Europe.[1][7][8] The finished engines are shipped back to BMW in Germany where the bikes are assembled. G650GS models with the Chinese-assembled engines can be easily identified as the engines are painted black while in the earlier European-assembled engines were finished in silver. For a short period prior to discontinuation of the bike in 2007 the engines were assembled by Kymco in Taiwan.
The G650GS received some upgrades over the F650GS of 2007: the engine now produces 3 additional horsepower (now 53 hp) and received a stronger 400 watt alternator.[1] In the United States and Australia, ABS and heated grips are now standard equipment instead of additional cost options.[1] An emergency services specific version of the G 650GS, fitted with blue lights and sirens, is available from BMW Motorrad's Official and special duty vehicles division.[9]
In 2010, at the EICMA show in Italy, BMW Motorrad announced the global availability of the G650GS with a slightly down-rated engine producing 35 kW (47 hp).[10][11]

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BMW has only itself to blame for the confusion, since they changed the model name of the 650cc single from F650GS to G650GS, then started using the F650GS name for the new parallel twin bike that was launched in 2009 along with the F800GS. To add to the confusion, the F650GS is not even a 650cc engine, but a 798cc (i.e., "800cc") engine that is essentially the same engine as that in the F800GS! Why, oh why, couldn't they just keep using the F650GS name for the thumper, and come up with something new for the new twin. And why, oh why, did BMW think it necessary to build two separate bikes around the new 800cc parallel twin engine -- one designated as an 800 and the other designated as a 650??? These guys may be marketing geniuses, but they are not particularly honest with their customers.

dang.

Heiri,

Yes, you got it right! My "lock, stock and cylinder" comment was a (weak) play on the common English idiom "lock, stock and barrel", which is a gun reference and means "the whole thing" or "in its entirety" -- i.e., "gesamte".

cheers!

Actually I think that maybe the Harley-Davidson Sportster 883 is made in China. The reason for this is that they are available to be bought in China for an almost reasonable price compared to other bikes. If you think that they are made in Milwakee USA I'll string shit out with unsubstantiated hunches based on nonsense and refuse to listen to reason including sworn testimony of people who actually know what they are talking about. I'll always include 'I could be wrong but' in my posts to avoid actually being plain wrong.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ZMC888

Actually I think that maybe the Harley-Davidson Sportster 883 is made in China. The reason for this is that they are available to be bought in China for an almost reasonable price compared to other bikes. If you think that they are made in Milwakee USA I'll string shit out with unsubstantiated hunches based on nonsense and refuse to listen to reason including sworn testimony of people who actually know what they are talking about. I'll always include 'I could be wrong but' in my posts to avoid actually being plain wrong.

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You could be wrong because the Sporster is manufactured in Kansas City, Missouri (– Vehicle and Powertrain Operations: Manufacturing site of Sportster, VRSC, and other vehicles) according to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harley-Davidson which could be wrong.:lol8:

I got a hunch that HD 883 is made in the North Pole by Father Christmas, that explains the reasonable price too.

I could be wrong, but I've had enough of this picking on heiri of yours.

Peace

IMHO,I think the key word with the BMW 650 is "assembled" by Loncin.I believe the engine parts are machined by company X and assembled by Loncin.Same thing with my car.It's parts are manufactured in the US but it is assembled in Canada.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by marcomagica

I could be wrong, but I've had enough of this picking on heiri of yours.

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Picking on heiri? Really if I wanted to learn about something I didn't know anything about, lets say 4x4's in China I'd go on-line and maybe join a forum. Then when there is another forum user who had lots more posts than me and had been keen to learn things about the subject for the last 9 years and had visited 4 factories I might just shut up and let them know something more than me rather than making up horse shit at every turn.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ben2go

IMHO,I think the key word with the BMW 650 is "assembled" by Loncin.I believe the engine parts are machined by company X and assembled by Loncin.Same thing with my car.It's parts are manufactured in the US but it is assembled in Canada

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Almost certainly Loncin make the whole engine, sorry. Massive company, they even make mediocre cars too. Chinese manufacturing is too low quality to outsource to other companies like that, there would be too many mistakes.

Ok back to topic please !

Is Soberpete still on the forums, could we go back to a review of the YBR250 ?
I'd like to know about the reliability so far of this bike, and the real-life performance of the bike :
- max speed ?
- good cruising speed without being too hard on the throttle : 90 km/h, 100 km/h ?
- what about 2-up : what is your pillion review of the bike : pillion seat comfort, foot rests position, cramped legs, etc. ?

Thanks a lot for all YBR250 owners who could reply.

Cheers,

Fred

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Fred

Ok back to topic please !

Is Soberpete still on the forums, could we go back to a review of the YBR250 ?
I'd like to know about the reliability so far of this bike, and the real-life performance of the bike :
- max speed ?
- good cruising speed without being too hard on the throttle : 90 km/h, 100 km/h ?
- what about 2-up : what is your pillion review of the bike : pillion seat comfort, foot rests position, cramped legs, etc. ?

Thanks a lot for all YBR250 owners who could reply.

Cheers,

Fred

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I've also just bought a YBR250 and so far so good, it's a good bike.

Having only 150 Km on it I shouldn't have pushed her, but I've already brought her at 115 on the speedometer, no vibrations, it runs great. Max rated speed is 126 Km/h but I doubt I can squeeze that out with my 130+ Kg, I'll try later on when the engine has a few more Km on the clock.

It runs 80 Km/h at at just over 5K rpm,that's my comfort zone, but also 90Km/h at around 6K rpm is a good pace for the engine.

For the pillion review I can't really say, as I'm just under 2 meters so legs are little cramped, but it's not too bad, I find the seat comfortable.

Overall the motorbike feels solid and responsive, I'm very pleased with it!

The HD 883 is made in the North Pole by Father Christmas? :confused1:
BMW bikes? :eek2:
ZMC888 has made Heiri his new arch-nemesis? :gun_bandana:
...
I've been away from home for over two weeks in my wife's hometown. The internet connection down there is awful so I've been away for a while. Looks like a missed a lot.

Marcomagica. Good on you for joining the YBR 250 club :clap:. Treat yours well and I'm sure it'll please you as mine has pleased me.

Fred.
-I've reached over 135kph (I'm a skinny 65kg b*stard) on it but I'm not sure if the speedometer is entirely precise. I'd like to think it is (Yamaha is not a bad brand in my eyes) but I still need to GPS test it.

-In fifth gear it cruises at 78kph/5000rpm. I found that I could get about 600km on one full tank of petrol riding like that.
Since I fully broke the engine in I've been cruising very comfortably between 90 and 120kph/6000rpm - 7800rpm and that's brought the distance of a full tank down to just over 500km. It costs me about 125 Chinese RMB to fill it to the brim.
Like Marcomagica said, there are no vibrations and it's really comfy. After an hour or so of riding over 100kph, however, my hands go slightly numb from the vibrations that the engine sends through the handlebars. I never got that kind of sensation while riding below 5000rpm/6000rpm during the 1000km/1600km break in period, of course.

-2 up on the YBR 250 is no problem :riding:. My wife weighs around 40kg and I barely notice the difference in acceleration with her on the back. You can really feel the torque that it puts out while carrying the extra weight.
I just got back from Mengyin, a 180km trip, with a 25kg rucksack on my back; I could still get 130kph out of it going up a shallow hill and 105kph going up a steep one. Overtaking is piece of cake at any speed below 100kph, especially uphill.

-The seat is big, comfy and firm. It allows you space to sit further forward or further back depending on your riding style preference (While doing speeds over 110kph I tend to sit my arse further back in order to get my head down).
I have never been on the back seat but my wife has never complained about it being uncomfortable. Just be sure to warn whoever sits behind you to lean into you and hold on. It wouldn't be hard to throw someone off the back by just whacking the throttle on.
-The pegs are directly beneath my shoulders. I can get both my feet down at traffic lights and it's really easy to push the bike backwards while seated. It's a pain to push the bike forwards while seated because the pegs get in the way but the engine can take care of all of the forward movement work.
-I'm 178cm tall with fairly long legs and only ever feel a little cramped after about two hours of solid riding. I don't feel any discomfort if I stop and stretch my legs (walk around) after every hour.

I have over 3000km on the clock now. I've had no problems other than the brake light trip switches being too loose (not coming on unless you squeeze the brake really hard) but that only took a minute to adjust. There is one small part of the exhaust that has gone rusty and the chain went rusty a few weeks ago too. I go the chain oiled up and might swap it if need be but not sure right now...

Sorry Pete, while you were away they switched production of the Jianshe Yamaha YBR250 to Brazil or was it Japan? Or was it just the engine? :eek2:

Wow, thanks a lot for the detailed review Pete, that's very good to know.
I'm particularly interested in the cruising speed. Let's say 110kph is very very good compared to what I have now, and could really shorten those long distances to go to Zhejiang.... Hmmmm....

I have one further question : would you know (or anyone else) if Yamaha can provide a topcase in order to tour with this bike, which would have a cushion or pad for the pillion to rest against it ?
If not Yamaha, maybe I can find this at the bike market I guess, but it needs to be really really properly secure... ;-))



One more thing before you reply : rust on the exhaust and chain after 3,000 km only ? This is strange and a little worrying... Do you often ride when wet, do you oil regularly your chain ?
Thanks in advance for the replies.

Cheers Peter,

I've to say if I pulled the trigger on the YBR250 is mostly because of this post, I was leaning to the JH600 before, but difficulty to get it registered in my area made me go on the YBR.

I'm very pleased with it so far, so thank you Peter!

I hope the government will rise the limit of "normally" registrable bikes to 600 or 650, because even the YBR250 is good, I would like more horsepower under my ass, namely when I have an annoying black audi with pillows under the back windows honking at my ass, I'd like to be able to let him taste my exhaust fumes and put a safe distance between me and the moron before giving him the road.

This is more about safety than for my pleasure to go fast, in fact i don't enjoy going fast, but is better to have it, in case you need it. Don't take me wrong, the YBR250 IS responsive and can accelerate quite fast, perhaps is just me, being used to other kind of bikes back in Europe.

I've seen photos on a thread by tokyokid named 'Tibet Odysee' but the pictures that used to be there seem to have been deleted now. He had a sort of saddle thing that slung around the fuel tank and was laced with satchels for storing things. He also had two back boxes mounted either side of the rear wheel. The frame that supported those boxes also had a 90 degree cushion for the pillion-seat rider.
I could go back to the dealer and ask them if it's possible to order some but I know they'd be clueless to begin with. They'll promise to call their contacts and ask, but that may take some time. I'd need to go back two or three times to remind them before they get around to it.

One small piece of metal that is part of the exhaust is rusty, no other part of the bike is. I washed the bike a number of times, then rode it through the rain a few more times without putting oil on the chain once so I guess I was really asking for it to go rusty. I'll take some photos of it later.

Nice review Pete. Glad to see the YBR250 continues to impress. :clap:

Thanks Dewsnap,
How is the Raptor doing? What kind of mileage have you racked up so far? I passed the 3000km mark a few days ago.

I've just completed my fourth trip (last two on the YBR) to and from my wife's hometown. Half of the roads are great to ride on but the other half are awful so I've been trying new routes in search of better roads for a better overall ride.
I discovered a road on the way back a few days ago and made the mistake of taking it. This road was a really muddy, narrow and crowed village road that had suffered heavy rainfall the night before. Some of the roads were flooded and I delicately rode the YBR along 50ft of slippery mud banks, wheels only inches away from a huge pool of water where the road should have been. It was a real thrill to have avoided taking a swim in that water.
What's funny was that half of the village was out, watching me as I performed the stunt that the other motorcyclists wouldn't. I could feel their eyes on me as I was riding the mud bank, making bets on whether or not I'd slip up. I showed'em :muscles:.


Marco,
I know what you mean about having the extra power just in-case you need it. My dad only drives cars with an engine size V8 or higher. He says that it can get you out of the tight spots where accidents are likely to happen. He lives in the states though. He wouldn't like driving on Chinese roads, that's for sure :frump:.

It sounds like there are lots of open roads in your area. In Zibo I never get the typical aggressive driver hassling me from behind, they're only ever in-front of me for a few seconds before I leave them behind. I'm pretty damn aggressive and only get overtaken when I choose to stop.
Anyway, back to the point: The roads around here are rarely large enough to make me wish I had anything bigger than a 250cc bike. The roads are either too small or just too full of cars and bikes. The YBR gets me through almost everything and makes me feel like the fastest thing on the road... despite the presence of 3 three dozen illegal super-bikes stolen from HongKong or wherever.

I'm really happy to hear that this thread was a contributing factor in your decision to buy a YBR 250. What colour did you get? Oh, wait... I just took a look at your profile photo. It looks good in red. What colour offers did the dealer give you?

hi marco, pete convered your question to the full i'd say and after around 60000km (6x10000) with the ybr250 we have no problems at all. ad two up - for a couple of 100km on a fairly nice tarmac road in tibet i had a couple rideing the bike - their guess was that incl gear they got around 200kg on the bike. (i did not like it too much but it worked)
just had to bikes going with pillion to mt. kailash in tibet - nice roads for most of the part and real nice ride with around 150 to 160kg up i'd say. we shifted the girls in the pack up car when going gravel though! i am sure you will enjoy riding the bike - wherever it comes from ;-) btw. 5 new one's are on the way from beijing (the only place i could find 5pcs at all) to lhasa.

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Originally Posted by euphonius

“Could well be"???

Heiri, now I'm beginning to understand why ZMC888 finds your posts so exasperating! What is it about facts that you find so difficult?

Your BMW buddies may be in denial, but that Loncin-built BMW engine is famous here in China, and very widely known. People who have visited the factory have posted pictures of the production line and the BMW engine for all to see, including this guy from India.

Here's another thread, alas in Chinese, though you can use Google's Chrome browser and accept its offer to translate the entire post into English, or German, in 2 seconds. The main poster is a Loncin employee. Even without translating, you can scroll through a few pages and see from the pictures alone that Loncin indeed builds the BMW 650 thumper (not to be confused with the BMW 650 twin, which is actually closer to 800cc) in its entirety and is very publicly proud of this fact, as are many chinese forum posters. Here are a few images:


Perhaps you'd like to buy one of these Chinese-made BMW engines. Prepare 12,000 RMB and browse to this link on Taobao (again, use Google's Chrome browser), which is where I found this image:

http://img07.taobaocdn.com/imgextra/...!!94883338.jpg

I do share your hope that we'll see that BMW engine in Chinese bikes, though I doubt BMW would be happy about that. No matter, Loncin has the technology and ability and perhaps already is doing this. The engine in our 600cc Jialings, which was designed by AVL of Austria, is a very close cousin of that BMW thumper. It's entirely possible that Jialing, rather than making them in house, outsources them from Loncin, which a just few miles across town in Chongqing.

The problem with the China market is that it's too restrictive and too small for anything above 200 or 250cc. Until motorcycles lose their stigma as farm vehicles and "the poor man's automobile", and become cherished for recreation and commuting by the middle class, demand for mid-sized and large displacement bikes in China will remain too limited to drive such innovation.

cheers!

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euphonius THANKS and i sincerely mean that!
what i wanted to say with " it could well be" was something in the line of "es kann durchaus sein" translated below. by NOW with the facts given by you i have to say of course there is no doubt. but i still do not see that because i do, as a non-native speaker, make "unclear" statements can cause such a fuzz. i guess i have to stay away of that kind of discussions! sorry to have disturbed your peace here!

Other people translated 'Es kann durchaus sein' into English:
German English

Es kann durchaus sein, dass dies für viele eine Schmerzgrenze darstellt, die sie nicht überschreiten wollen.
German: www.europarl.europa.eu/
It may well indeed be that many will see this as a pain barrier through which they do not want to go.
English: www.europarl.europa.eu/

Es kann durchaus sein, dass sie bei einem adäquaten Angebot eine Professur an einer anderen Universität annimmt.
German: www.lifescience-zurich.ch/focus10/oxenius-de.asp
It is absolutely possible that, with an adequate offer, she would accept a professorship at another university.
English: www.lifescience-zurich.ch/focus10/oxenius-en.asp

Es kann durchaus sein, daß dies nicht für alle Zukunft so bleibt, da die Gentechnik uns in anderen Zusammenhängen helfen kann, von unnatürlichen Methoden wegzukommen.
German: www.europarl.europa.eu/
This may not always be the case in the future, as genetic technology may help us to move away from non-natural methods in other contexts.
English: www.europarl.europa.eu/

To come back on the YBR 250, I saw a "new" 2011 YBR 250, with a different headlight, and surely others more subtle differences. Look below :

Current YBR 250 :
Attachment 5078


2011 version :
Attachment 5079

Anyone know something about this, if it would be available in China, and when ? I found this pic here : http://www.motorcycledb.com/Yamaha_YBR250_2011/34783 but no other info.

I went to the Yamaha store last Friday, but didn't know about the "new" version then.
What I saw is that the current YBR 250 version is listed at RMB 25,000, available in black or red.

Shit, I've just bought the old model! That would explain also the shortage of stock Heiri was talking about.

To be honest I don't like the new look, but damn it, I WANT THAT REAR DISK BRAKE!

I may be wrong, but I'm fairly certain that the newer looking YBR 250 is the FAZER version that is being sold in Brazil right now. I also found that photo on the web while looking up info on the YBR 250 just before purchasing it. The FAZER's rear light is also more of a vertical diamond shape, opposed to the flatter rear light of our Chinese YBR 250. It also has protruding rear indicators whereas our YBR's have them included into the frame.

***I just took a closer look at that photo. You can see 'FAZER' printed on the fuel tank***

Quote:

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Originally Posted by soberpete

I may be wrong, but I'm fairly certain that the newer looking YBR 250 is the FAZER version that is being sold in Brazil right now. I also found that photo on the web while looking up info on the YBR 250 just before purchasing it. The FAZER's rear light is also more of a vertical diamond shape, opposed to the flatter rear light of our Chinese YBR 250. It also has protruding rear indicators whereas our YBR's have them included into the frame.

***I just took a closer look at that photo. You can see 'FAZER' printed on the fuel tank***

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Yes, I think you're right Pete. Anyway, I'll go back to the dealer at the end of this week and I'll ask them about any new model coming to China. I'll report what I hear here.

One question : I sat on the YBR 250 at the dealer and felt a bit cramped, but maybe it's because I'm used to the Honda Shadow. I'm 1m83 (6 ft). It's not a problem for you for long trips ?

Fred, I doubt that the Fazer will ever be available at a reasonable price (or at all) here in China. They seem to do fairly well selling the Jianshe Yamaha YBR250 in China so I can't imagine them building the Fazer here too. The cost of beginning to manufacture the new model here or even getting them imported would make them too expensive to buy. I wouldn't bother asking them if I were you, but you never know.

About the cramping issue, like I said "I'm 178cm tall with fairly long legs and only ever feel a little cramped after about two hours of solid riding". You're a few inches taller than me, so I can't say for sure but I would guess that you may begin to feel some discomfort in your legs after an hour or so of riding. Anyway, it's really just something that comes with riding a street bike. Better position, better control and a different feel albeit not as comfy as a cruiser.
A Honda Shadow! That's a nice big cruiser and I'm guessing that you never got crampt legs on that thing. Have you ever ridden a street bike or anything with a similar position to the YBR250? If not, then I would say it's a choice between bike types:
-Cruisers have the look of style and the feel of comfort but lack handling and the proper seat position to take corners at speed.
-Street bikes have the seating postion you need to take coners at speed and give you the feel of control and acurate balance (the way a motorcycle should be... some say).
My first bike was a 150cc cruiser and although I really like the look of cruisers I would never go back to one after getting a street bike.

Attachment 5085Attachment 5086

The evil rust!
It's confined to the inside of that single piece of metal on the exhaust pipe. I'm not really worried about it though.

Attachment 5087

The chain began to get rusty after several months of me washing the bike numerous times and riding over 300km in rain without being oiled once. I've oiled it a few times since I began to take note of the rust.
I need some expert advice: Should I replace the chain or will it be ok if I just keep on oiling it?

Hi Peter,

For the chain you just need to clean it on the sides (WD40 and brush should be enough) and grease it. Chains are changed if some chain links are stuck or if the chain becomes too long. This is just minor rust, nothing important.


As for the exhaust I would suggest put some anti-rust paint on that little spot and paint it over black. It's not much at the moment but it could grow up in an hole in the exhaust over time, the paint job of the interior of that particular point was not done well at factory... or wait, is it the bolt that keep that piece that is rusting?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by soberpete

Fred, I doubt that the Fazer will ever be available at a reasonable price (or at all) here in China. They seem to do fairly well selling the Jianshe Yamaha YBR250 in China so I can't imagine them building the Fazer here too. The cost of beginning to manufacture the new model here or even getting them imported would make them too expensive to buy. I wouldn't bother asking them if I were you, but you never know.

About the cramping issue, like I said "I'm 178cm tall with fairly long legs and only ever feel a little cramped after about two hours of solid riding". You're a few inches taller than me, so I can't say for sure but I would guess that you may begin to feel some discomfort in your legs after an hour or so of riding. Anyway, it's really just something that comes with riding a street bike. Better position, better control and a different feel albeit not as comfy as a cruiser.
A Honda Shadow! That's a nice big cruiser and I'm guessing that you never got crampt legs on that thing. Have you ever ridden a street bike or anything with a similar position to the YBR250? If not, then I would say it's a choice between bike types:
-Cruisers have the look of style and the feel of comfort but lack handling and the proper seat position to take corners at speed.
-Street bikes have the seating postion you need to take coners at speed and give you the feel of control and acurate balance (the way a motorcycle should be... some say).
My first bike was a 150cc cruiser and although I really like the look of cruisers I would never go back to one after getting a street bike.

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Thanks for the reply Pete, I dont have any more questions... for now ! ;-))

About the Honda Shadow, I'm not talking about the 750cc version of course, but the 150cc Honda-Sundiro Shadow you can buy in China !
Yes, the position is very comfortable on that thing, and yes too, it's maybe not the best to take corners at speed. I can't wait to try a street bike to feel/experience the difference.

My mind is made up on a red YBR 250 now, but all the paperwork will be terribly "mafan" :
- changing the plates registration from the Honda to the Yam
- changing the insurance to the new bike
- selling the Shadow (I'll post an advertisement on the forum later) and helping the buyer to get it plated.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Fred

Thanks for the reply Pete, I dont have any more questions... for now ! ;-))

About the Honda Shadow, I'm not talking about the 750cc version of course, but the 150cc Honda-Sundiro Shadow you can buy in China !
Yes, the position is very comfortable on that thing, and yes too, it's maybe not the best to take corners at speed. I can't wait to try a street bike to feel/experience the difference.

My mind is made up on a red YBR 250 now, but all the paperwork will be terribly "mafan" :
- changing the plates registration from the Honda to the Yam
- changing the insurance to the new bike
- selling the Shadow (I'll post an advertisement on the forum later) and helping the buyer to get it plated.

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Hi Fred, Hi hope you also pull the trigger on the YBR. As Peter says "The YBR doesn't disappoint"!

Why you don't just sell your bike plated and get new plates for the new one? Or wait, you have one of those expensive Shanghai plates on yours?

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Originally Posted by marcomagica

Hi Fred, Hi hope you also pull the trigger on the YBR. As Peter says "The YBR doesn't disappoint"!

Why you don't just sell your bike plated and get new plates for the new one? Or wait, you have one of those expensive Shanghai plates on yours?

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Yes I do, bought mine in March for RMB 46,000, currently they sell for RMB 50,000, so no, I don't really want to sell them yet and buy new ones. ;-)) I'm hoping my plates could be a good investment if the prices are always increasing.

Moreover, I think that selling a legal bike WITHOUT the plates could be easier in Shanghai :
- with the plates : RMB 50,000 + the price of the bike
- without the plates : the price of the bike + possibility for the buyer to choose a Hu C plates, much cheaper. :naughty:

I don't recall anyone posting in detail about the relative merits of selling a bike in Shanghai with plates vs without plates. ryanjpyle recently sold one of his MKRide.com bimmers, and sold the bike and plate in separate transactions, so he should have some sense of this.

If you keep the plate, there still will be a procedure for disassociating it from the bike, then reassigning it to your new bike. Not sure which is more mafan.

Guess it depends on whether your buyer wants a plate or not.

cheers

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Fred

Yes I do, bought mine in March for RMB 46,000, currently they sell for RMB 50,000, so no, I don't really want to sell them yet and buy new ones. ;-)) I'm hoping my plates could be a good investment if the prices are always increasing.

Moreover, I think that selling a legal bike WITHOUT the plates could be easier in Shanghai :
- with the plates : RMB 50,000 + the price of the bike
- without the plates : the price of the bike + possibility for the buyer to choose a Hu C plates, much cheaper. :naughty:

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Congratulations for the plates then, must hurt to know the value of the plates is more than the bike you ride!

But yes, that should be a good investment, that is if they don't suddenly rise the number of plates issued making the price dropping.
I really can't see that coming though, what Shanghai doesn't need is even more cars than they already have.

Good luck on your paperwork, and report back on the progresses when you pull the trigger!