Newbie to Yixing, Jiangsu, plans for a bike

Hey guys, new comer to riding in China. Was born in Hong Kong but lived in Canada for the better part of my life. Just relocated to my factory near Yixing, Jiangsu.

Was riding an '08 Honda VFR 800 before and looking to get either a dual sport in the 400-750cc range or a larger displacement sport tourer. From my visual searches, the local dealers only carry scooters of below 150cc bikes. Where are some of the places I can find larger displacement bikes in China? I heard of and will probably visit CJ Shanghai (my China driver license is ready in a month and I'll install a GPS in my car). I see Honda Beijing imports ST1300s and BMW Mottorad Shanghai but will probably cost an arm and a leg.... are there any legal grey importers in China that's good?

Thanks and see you guys out there on the road.

Stay safe.

Hi Titus, welcome to the forum! (and to jiangsu)

I'll help where i can. Firstly, you probably won't find any interesting bikes in your local dealers.
For larger displacement bikes, as far as know the only one you can register legally in china is the Jialing JH600. There are a few threads about this bike already on the forum. Buying a legal BMW in shanghai will cost you about the same as a meduim sized island in the pacific.
There's also the Asiawing LX450, which apparently is registerable, but i don't think anyone on these forums has one yet so we don't have any first hand reports about it.
Generally though, if you want to stay legal you'll be pretty starved for choice in big bikes. Most of us end up giving up and buying a chinese bike (some of which are pretty fun)

As for a CJ, i highly recommend you come and visit the shop in Suzhou. It's just on the other side of the lake from you, and there are some really great bikes being built there. It's run by a guy called Mr Wang, who isn't on these forums, but is very reputed in the area. Many shanghai bikers actually come to get their CJs worked on here. He built mine and i've already done 27000km on it. PM me if you're interested, i can arrange a visit for you. (very difficult place to find)

Let me know if you want to go for a ride, we live quite close!

Jialing JH600 the possibility of a 2nd hand BMW or remortgage your house!

http://en.jialing.com.cn/ProductPict...-JH600-8-0.jpg
Jialing JH600

Not exactly a VFR800 though, and if dual sport isn't your thing that could be a problem.

Check out the roads though....do you really need more than a 250cc or a bike over 160KG? In which case a Ninja 250 would be ideal, but that isn't legal either....but a YBR250 is legal.

Nice, thanks for the Felix and CMC!! haha

True about the roads.... it seems to be a flat plain area in Jiangsu (I imagine there's a lot of squared off 180 width tires LOL).

Yes Felix, I'll definitely visit you once I get my work stuff settled down and my license sorted out. Looks like the CJ is the most "practical" choice (though my wife is already telling me no way in hell she's riding the sidecar LOL). I gotta do more readings on it; is it like a Ural or the BMW R71?

I read another thread by bigG in Suzhou about those 2nd hand websites; I guess it's buyers beware there (the prices are also slightly above HK 2nd hand market)? I saw a FJR1300 going for 30k RMB, seems attractive as I could probably sell my vfr in HK for that and change. Having bikes like that serviced I guess is another matter...

Look forward to going for a ride with you guys once the dust settles!!

You are right, the roads in jiangsu are mostly flat and straight. Lake taihu has some nice enough spots that are close to us, but nothing spectacular. We are lucky enough to live in the south of jiangsu though, and just 150km away is Anji where there are some pretty cool mountain roads. Look at this area, the S206 and S304 are particularly good.

Both the ural and CJ750 are derived from the BMW R71. The CJ in china comes in two different engine versions, the 24hp flat head like the original R71, and the 32hp ohv which is like a ural (but less powerful). There is already a lot of stuff out there written about them so i'm not gonna bother. Your wife will definately change her mind, these bikes are great fun, and way more comfortable for her. Pimping it up a bit won't hurt either... I've had mine for two years, driven it a lot, and it's probably my most favorite possession in the world. It will not, however, replace your VFR as a way to get your adrenaline fix.

About buying a used big bike here; you've got a pretty good chance of buying a lemon. A lot of these bikes (possibly like the FJR1300 you saw) on the used bike websites have had a few owners, have been crashed, rebuilt, engines taken apart by incompetent people, etc... You don't really know what you're buying in a lot of cases, and when you find out after 100km that you need to spend another 30k on parts, you're on your own. I don't want to sound too cynical, but i have seen happen a few times already. If i was buying a used imported big bike, i think i would only buy one from someone i knew and trusted, who had had the bike for a while with no problems.
And yes, finding someone who can service such a bike is not going to be easy either. Most mechanics here have no experience with japanese 4cyl engines and will probably make it worst. And then there's the trust issue, i've a friend who recently found out that his mechanic had been stealing parts from his engine and replacing with old crashed parts.

Sometimes with the bigger Japanese bikes, being conservative might be an option, you can pick up a mint condition CB400 which might be 10 years old for 15,000, and have a good chance at finding parts. But some of the more 'exotic' bikes have often been crashed and even have parts such as forks from other bikes, which are just plain dangerous, and have no parts available as Felix mentioned.

The reason that I ride legally, even when most of my Chinese motorcycling friends do not is:

- In my home country, registration, insurance etc are a requirement.
- The cops CAN stop you and impound your bike, this causes paranoia, and restricts your time and location of movement.
- Big problems if there is an accident.

I am sympathetic to those who aren't legal, the law is a bit ridiculous, for example it's illegal for women to drive cars in Saudi Arabia! Should you ignore bad laws or not? We need to make our own choices here.

There are dealers in Shanghai who can help you with larger displacement bikes. The only problem is that you'll have to pay a premium for licensing (40-50000). There are dealerships in Jiaxin and Wujiang that can help you get ahold of Regal Raptors and a few imported bikes if you're interested too.

Many thanks for the advice about the FJR, you're right... forking out all that money and then having to worry while on the road constantly isn't what I consider "fun". Will look into the CJ and contact you once I get my first RMB salary! =)

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Originally Posted by felix

You are right, the roads in jiangsu are mostly flat and straight. Lake taihu has some nice enough spots that are close to us, but nothing spectacular. We are lucky enough to live in the south of jiangsu though, and just 150km away is Anji where there are some pretty cool mountain roads. Look at this area, the S206 and S304 are particularly good.

Both the ural and CJ750 are derived from the BMW R71. The CJ in china comes in two different engine versions, the 24hp flat head like the original R71, and the 32hp ohv which is like a ural (but less powerful). There is already a lot of stuff out there written about them so i'm not gonna bother. Your wife will definately change her mind, these bikes are great fun, and way more comfortable for her. Pimping it up a bit won't hurt either... I've had mine for two years, driven it a lot, and it's probably my most favorite possession in the world. It will not, however, replace your VFR as a way to get your adrenaline fix.

About buying a used big bike here; you've got a pretty good chance of buying a lemon. A lot of these bikes (possibly like the FJR1300 you saw) on the used bike websites have had a few owners, have been crashed, rebuilt, engines taken apart by incompetent people, etc... You don't really know what you're buying in a lot of cases, and when you find out after 100km that you need to spend another 30k on parts, you're on your own. I don't want to sound too cynical, but i have seen happen a few times already. If i was buying a used imported big bike, i think i would only buy one from someone i knew and trusted, who had had the bike for a while with no problems.
And yes, finding someone who can service such a bike is not going to be easy either. Most mechanics here have no experience with japanese 4cyl engines and will probably make it worst. And then there's the trust issue, i've a friend who recently found out that his mechanic had been stealing parts from his engine and replacing with old crashed parts.

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Same here, I applied in HK for a legal China licence, costs me 1650 bucks HKD including 4 wheeled license, but I like the peace of mind that if anything happens at least legally I'm covered somewhat. My dad had the same license done up last year and got nicked by a radar gun on his second trip and it was a good thing we had all the legal stuff.

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Originally Posted by ZMC888

Sometimes with the bigger Japanese bikes, being conservative might be an option, you can pick up a mint condition CB400 which might be 10 years old for 15,000, and have a good chance at finding parts. But some of the more 'exotic' bikes have often been crashed and even have parts such as forks from other bikes, which are just plain dangerous, and have no parts available as Felix mentioned.

The reason that I ride legally, even when most of my Chinese motorcycling friends do not is:

- In my home country, registration, insurance etc are a requirement.
- The cops CAN stop you and impound your bike, this causes paranoia, and restricts your time and location of movement.
- Big problems if there is an accident.

I am sympathetic to those who aren't legal, the law is a bit ridiculous, for example it's illegal for women to drive cars in Saudi Arabia! Should you ignore bad laws or not? We need to make our own choices here.

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Thanks for that, yikes haha yea not cheap getting them in Shanghai I guess! Will get in touch when I have to make up my mind in a few months.

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Originally Posted by Nuhaus

There are dealers in Shanghai who can help you with larger displacement bikes. The only problem is that you'll have to pay a premium for licensing (40-50000). There are dealerships in Jiaxin and Wujiang that can help you get ahold of Regal Raptors and a few imported bikes if you're interested too.

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Originally Posted by Titus

Hey guys, new comer to riding in China. Was born in Hong Kong but lived in Canada for the better part of my life. Just relocated to my factory near Yixing, Jiangsu.

Was riding an '08 Honda VFR 800 before and looking to get either a dual sport in the 400-750cc range or a larger displacement sport tourer. From my visual searches, the local dealers only carry scooters of below 150cc bikes. Where are some of the places I can find larger displacement bikes in China? I heard of and will probably visit CJ Shanghai (my China driver license is ready in a month and I'll install a GPS in my car). I see Honda Beijing imports ST1300s and BMW Mottorad Shanghai but will probably cost an arm and a leg.... are there any legal grey importers in China that's good?

Thanks and see you guys out there on the road.

Stay safe.

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Gidday and welcome.
Just want to add my ten fen's worth...
As you are finding out from other posters/replies here, there are a number of issues concerning large displacement bikes in PRC. Legal 500cc+ motorcycles are available here such as Harley-Davidson, Ducati, BMW etc to name but a few. A couple of friends of mine have Harleys and they are all legal (one has three all bought from the Harley dealer in SH), even though they don't live in Shanghai they easily managed to get the license plates, which can be relevant as some cities will only issue motorcycle plates for those motorcycles supplied with a local (or same province) issued sale invoice (fapiao). Also there are outright bans in a number of PRC cities which mean that no plates are issued for any motorcycle, and motorcycles are prohibited from being ridden within the city boundaries etc.

Grey market bikes, can be sourced easily enough, but you do have to be careful, and for gawds-sake don't buy this kind of item on Taobao, the prices are ridiculous for a reason, and if you investigate you will find many of the motorcycles are priced so low FOR A REASON (usually they are stolen and smuggled in from HK via GuangDong/ShenZhen). Take a look at some of the photos of motorcycles on Taobao, look at the surroundings and environment, very few are in nice well equipped workshops etc. Moreover, how many of those bikes have had good parts swapped out for inferior/second hand parts?

Even for more reputable grey market dealers such as those that can be found in a place like TianMa race circuit (Shanghai), they will often get you a plate -but (and a BIG BUT!) the plate will be a duplicate of another bike of the same or similar make and model. That often means in reality that there are going to be at least two bikes running with the same plates elsewhere (gawd-forbid you happen to live and reside in the same or neighbouring city) :P The dealer will change the engine/frame numbers etc, and the ones I have seen are done very well, so well one cannot tell that the numbers have been changed.

As for CJ's keep in mind that actually the licensing of these bikes in PRC is an issue, and especially so when it comes to having a foreigners name placed on the license documents etc. Never mind the reliability/build quality issues, or even the usability factor. Having a sidecar (or outfit) restricts where and how you can ride the outfit... may as well have a car IMO. I know two guys perosnally that have had outfits for years here, both of them have given up riding them, having stored them away and got back onto two wheeled bikes...

If you are happy with expense, then consider a new Bemmer, Duke, Harley... but be prepared to pay 100%+ mark-up on top of the RRP elsewhere (you could probably pick up a new 883cc Sportster for around 110-120k. A workable method to working out what something is likely to be owrth in PRC is to find out the international cost and then double it. When I recently looked at a F800GS at Bemmer in Shanghai, the cost was double that of what I could pick up a new in AUS/NZ.

The JiaLing JH600 is a viable alternative, and can be legally licensed here in PRC where motorcycles are not banned. Or, you might like to consider something like a 250cc scooter? I've had a couple and just sold (CFMoto 250cc VIP) one to guy in Shanghai, and helped him transfer my plate which was easily doable (I live outside SH). I never rode scooters until I came here 8 years ago, but out of forced circumstances... I'm a convert! Even a die-hard mate who just returned from a week of surfing in Taiwan, where he also spent a week riding a 125cc there, raved about the experience (he and I ride 1100cc bikes here in PRC).

Also consider that unless you buy from a reputable dealer with dealer support (which still can be questionable at times), you are likely to want to have resort and rely on your ability for servicing and so forth. Whereas a locally manufactured bike is more likely to be serviceable out and about which can sueful when you are far away from your home base.

Check out the options as there are many, but just be bloody cautious. You really are best of with a bike that you can have transferred legally into your name, then the major issue is a legal bike, versus grey market, versus a bike without plate whatsoever...

If you want some great rides look us up in ZheJiang province... a small group of half-a-dozen who often ride together, which is supplemented by ride gatherings of about 150+ large/big bore bikes from all over ZheJiang two to three times per year. Here there are just so many good rides, mountains... rivers... lakes etc. Lived in JiangSu, Shanghai and other places... and certainly JiangSu and SH don't compare!

Sunny shiny side up!
=)

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Originally Posted by bikerdoc

As for CJ's keep in mind that actually the licensing of these bikes in PRC is an issue, and especially so when it comes to having a foreigners name placed on the license documents etc. Never mind the reliability/build quality issues, or even the usability factor. Having a sidecar (or outfit) restricts where and how you can ride the outfit... may as well have a car IMO. I know two guys perosnally that have had outfits for years here, both of them have given up riding them, having stored them away and got back onto two wheeled bikes...

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Interesting. Here in suzhou i've been told that my CJ is only legal as long as i keep the sidecar. I did ride it solo for a short time and didn't have any trouble either.
Either way, in three years of riding i've hardly ever had any trouble. I've never been stopped outside of suzhou city center, which is banned to all bikes. And i was riding in there during the day, which was kind of pushing my luck. I have nantong plates on my bike, which i'm sure would be no problem in yixing either.

If you buy an imported bike in Shanghai, the receipt is enough.. You do not need to register in Shanghai. Register the bike in the town where you are registered is best. Make sure the bikes are legally imported. The shelf life of a vehicle in China is 15 years. You buy a 10 year old bike you have five years life left.
I rode a Chair for 13 years here in China. Mostly now bikes are not allowed in cities (unless after 9pm when joe plod goes to bed) and the idea of riding a chair long distance is not sensible. Very tiring, always getting stuck in traffic and so listen to your wife.
The other thing about riding in China is it is incredibly dangerous man. I've been lucky.. just had my first bite of tarseal since I've been here. 2 am, no traffic on the road and a truck coming the other way decided to turn left. I had to put the bike down and push off. The bike wedged itself under the truck. Had I still been with it I would now be two legs shorter.
I'd not drive any sport bikes or sport tourers or tourers.. Too light and center of gravity too high.. To easy to fall off. I rode until a couple of days ago an 1100 dragstar. Most of my friends do. I'm the first one in years to have had an accident.
bikerdoc is right. The jialing is probably the best no brainer you can buy. It is reliable.. many guys have ridden these ugly things many hundreds of thousands of miles. It is cheap and therefore not so painful if it gets broken. It is a mincing and servile underpowered bike but when I was a little whippersnapper a 650 bonnie was about as cool as you could get and those things if you could keep them running long enough were not powerful enough to pull granny of her pot.
You're new to China and keen to get on a bike.. That is good.. First step I'd say is the Jialing. Get some experience and then decide what you want to do. It's easy to register and insure and no hassles. If your wife doesnt' like it you can always get another one (wife I mean!.).
Bikerdoc and I are probably going to get a couple, then we'll either not look so stupid or look doubly stupid.

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Originally Posted by felix

Interesting. Here in suzhou i've been told that my CJ is only legal as long as i keep the sidecar. I did ride it solo for a short time and didn't have any trouble either.
Either way, in three years of riding i've hardly ever had any trouble. I've never been stopped outside of suzhou city center, which is banned to all bikes. And i was riding in there during the day, which was kind of pushing my luck. I have nantong plates on my bike, which i'm sure would be no problem in yixing either.

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Hey Felix,
Side-cars are illegal when the chair is removed, though like many things here, blind eyes are turned unless they're (Traffic PSB) is targeting that specifically. I've also ridden many places where bikes are forbidden/banned and have never had any problems either, but then I tend to take it quietly & don't go out of my way, so as not to raise any questioning eyes of suspicion etc. When it comes to out-of-town plates, I believe the best policy is to make sure your vehicle is legal/legit as much as possible, so that one can minimise any potential problems. My bikes are licensed in Zhejiang, but I have ridden without any problems in many other provinces/cities etc. It also helps to play the card that I can't speak/understand much Chinese. I know that's helped me several times :naughty:

Felix.. Bikerdoc is in fact correct.. Back in 1996 I took the chair off and rode into hangzhou. They took the bike off me as it was illegal. It's registered as a three wheeler and you do not need a full motorcycle license for riding the Chair.

And yes.. Zhejiang is absolutely amazing for riding motorcycles...

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Originally Posted by Jonsims

not need a full motorcycle license for riding the Chair.

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I think this might be confusing. You do need a D type motorcylce license to ride a sidecar. This license also allows you to ride two wheelers. A normal E type motorcycle license does not allow you to ride a sidecar.

Titus, if you're harbouring thoughts of getting a sidecar but are not sure, then i strongly advise you to get a D license as you can ride anything with it.

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Originally Posted by felix

I think this might be confusing. You do need a D type motorcylce license to ride a sidecar. This license also allows you to ride two wheelers. A normal E type motorcycle license does not allow you to ride a sidecar.

Titus, if you're harbouring thoughts of getting a sidecar but are not sure, then i strongly advise you to get a D license as you can ride anything with it.

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You've got me now..... I'm not sure.. I have C 1 and D in my license.. I did my license 15 years ago.. It was a case of being asked "can you drive....." I answered yes so they gave me licenses.. I hear it is different now...... I'll have to go with titus.. Get the D and you're good for the trike... but seriously.. do you really want to ride a trike.. There are so many people who are going to get in your way... you're better off with the manouvreability of two wheels.....