Shanghai options - Ebike review

My panda and i moved to shanghai 3 months ago, which for me meant giving up riding my motorbikes to work everyday. My bikes have legal Jiangsu plates but only 沪A plates are allowed in Shanghai and i cannot/will not fork out the 44000 RMB necessary for the privilege of riding in one of the worst places on earth to ride a bike. So what options are left to stay on 2 wheels? Go illegal or go electric. Since i was partly buying this for my girlfiend, we went electric. (so that she can drive me home from the bar when i can't even spell my own face anymore) Here's what we got:

http://zrqncg.bay.livefilestore.com/...h/P1000282.jpg

http://zrqncg.bay.livefilestore.com/...J/P1000268.jpg

It cost 3300 RMB and is the "standard" spec for suped up ebikes, 800W, 48V, 20amps. It's faster than anything you'll buy at carrefour or the standard ebike shops but if you want to spend more money, all these custom shops can customise to your specs, up to 3000W motor, 84V or two banks of 48V for longer range etc...
Overall i like it enough for what it is. It's not very fast, top speed is GPS measured 47kph and acceleration isn't all that, but for running errands around the city it's very adequate. The range is ok, riding two-up we get about 35km if the tires are well inflated and i watch my throttle usage. Riding solo maybe 45km. The brakes are good (hydraulic disc brakes) and the tyres can carry enough speed through corners to scrape the kickstand.

Charging batteries is a bit of a pain. On these big modified ebikes the batteries are not removable so you better have somewhere to plug it in downstairs, which we do. Takes about 7 hours, meaning you need to rethink how and when you refuel. Coming from motorbikes, this is my biggest issue. Always having to plan ahead when and how long you are going to use it, to make sure you will have enough juice to get home. The battery gauge stays at 100% for very long, then dies away pretty quickly so just because you've made it somewhere and it says it's still got plenty, doesn't mean you'll make it back. If i'm going somewhere a bit far i usually measure my route on googlemaps first to see if i'll make it there and back. Pain in hole i know, but pushing isn't fun either.

So basically it's not my ideal form of transportation, but for shanghai i reckon it's one of the best options. Now that they have stopped selling fuel to scooters and that even sidecars with outside plates are being driven out, it's soon going be one of the last options besides buying the dreaded plate. Until they ban these as well that is...

http://zrqncg.bay.livefilestore.com/...3/P1000276.jpg

Good review Felix. I've been thinking about getting one of these for a few months now. Main thing holding me back is the lack of a portable battery though.

Nice thread Felix, it looks like you've made a rational decision for dealing with life in Shanghai. I remember when I first moved to Asia and started life in Taipei with no motorcycle, just a scooter, sometimes anything with two wheels is good enough. :riding:

Cheers!
ChinaV

Nuhaus, yep, if you don't have a convenient parking spot to charge the bike then these big ebikes are pretty much out. We are lucky to have that service in our complex, only 1 kuai per charge.

ChinaV you are correct, anything on two wheels is better than walking/taxi/bus/metro... If anything, being so underpowered teaches you to carry more speed through corners and obstacles!

Yes, definitely a great thread - nice pics!

My sweety and I each have e-bikes in Beijing. In fact, hers is the exact same model as yours, only an earlier, older version. Same color scheme, with roughly the same specs. Mine is a gigantic, macho, black thing. We've had them about five years. They've been amazingly reliable (manufacturer is XinRi, a Beijing company), summer and winter, aside from the locks on the boxes disintegrating. And they are not expensive, so I've not been concerned about simply Krazy gluing the various plastic bits that seem to fall off. The mirrors were stolen once, and replacements were 18 rmb for a pair, installed.

This is what I have learned:

1) e-scooters/bikes are the best thing there is for zooming around inner Beijing. We also have a legal gas scooter (Suzuki 125) for sweety, and a few other legal petrol bikes for me. But we both still prefer the e-scooters because we can legally use the bike lanes. Being legal in Beijing on a motorbike means you have a legal license plate that the traffic cameras pick up. Hence, a legal motorbike is stuck in Beijing gridlock. E-scooters zip around much more efficiently and quickly during daylight hours.

2) My black macho e-scooter is way too big. The battery is gigantic and I have to haul it in/out of my apartment to recharge on a too-frequent basis. A total pain (literally and figuratively). Also, it is not as nimble as sweety's e-scooter in the bike lanes, and can't easily tuck into tiny parking spots. The macho bike looks cool (albeit a dated model), but I've finally realized that I'm just too old to be concerned with being "cool".

3) Because of #2, I use my sweety's e-scooter ten times for every time I use the big black machine. Sweety's scoot is quick, nimble and the battery is easier to cart around. I look a little silly on it, but at least it isn't pink (although I think it has some pretty flower stickers on it).

4) I've also begun using my pedal bike, again, because using the e-scooter everywhere caused me to start putting on the kilos, big time. Battery lifting was the only exercise I was getting (which was more than I was getting on my petrol bikes).

5) I've run out of juice a few times. Forget about using the slip-on pedals. They are completely useless, and only available so that the e-scoots can be legally plated (a requirement in Beijing, so that the e-scoot can be called an e-bike). I just push the bike home if it dies (happened a few times). Or, once when I was far away, I took a taxi home with the battery and returned after a recharge.

6) The one-time plate fee in Beijing is 10 rmb and requires only a few minutes at the neighbourhood police station to acquire.

Bottom line - e-scoots are fantastic for urban commutes, especially given the convenience of bike lanes (and ease of parking). Beijing is flat. I think hills would be a problem for an e-scoot.

In Beijing, we have the Beijing chapter of the Mad Dogs motorcycle club ... who have Harleys, mandatory tattoos, patches, etc. :rolleyes1: I've wondered about starting a Beijing chapter of the Happy Poodles e-scooter club, complete with lick-on tattoos, peel & stick patches, etc. One would need to be rather self-assured with one's identity to join! :lol8:

Great story. The EBike rules seem enlightened when compared to the other tales and regulations you lot write about for us, a land of paradox eh? I wonder if they will ever have the sense to provide 500,000 EBikes painted red and gold and leave them in parking places for all to use and leave freely? No-one else on the planet does, it would be good to see.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by VinX

By the way, you were talking about really powerful electric one, any idea where to go to check it ?
I hate to say that cause i really think eletric ones are unconvenient and unfortunatly big ugly plastic piece... but i'd like to know the alternative... and hope there're others models available and not only the huge harler davidson/ poor vespa copy one and the small playmobile girlie one...

---

You can find a bunch of different styles for these big ebikes. Taobao is good place to look around for what's available. I used taobao to find an ebike shop near my place in xujiahui. Here are some search results showing some of what you can find in shanghai.

http://s.taobao.com/search?q=800&ex_...5-e&bcoffset=2

Taobao is handy to actually find shops. You'll see a lot of the taobao shops will say where they are located, then you can just go there directly to buy one. The most common spec for these is 800W 48V like i have. You'll have trouble finding a shop that has a higher spec in stock to try out, they are all made to order.

I got the vespa rip-off style because it was sort of for my girlfriend to have something to ride around shanghai. I hate anything chrome, here's what i really wanted:

http://img04.taobaocdn.com/bao/uploa...ZTa_120436.jpg

Laojaihuo, thank you for adding your thoughts. Interesting that you have to register them in beijing. I asked the shop about it here and they said not to bother with any of that. And yes, hills are killer for these bikes, especially riding two-up!

Jape, i don't think the ebike rules are particularly enlightened here. In fact these big ebikes aren't actually legal here (in shanghai anyway), they are just tolerated. That will surely change soon enough as great march continues to get all the poor people into cars or off the road.

Oh yeah, here's another one i like. As far as ebikes go here in china, it's not bad!

http://img02.taobaocdn.com/imgextra/...!!10925437.jpg

I just think of all the poor donkeys, mules, bullocks and camels that are destined to become chinese take-away now!

:lol8: Oh well, less methane :bs:and more CO2 in the atmosphere.:crazy:

Two wheels good, four wheels bad.

Out here in Kunming we have a law that forbids more than one person riding per E-bike. On every traffic light (if many policemen in sight), you see people getting off E-bikes crossing the street to meet their partners!! Same in Shanghai?

Felix,
A little off topic but is your panda a model? She is beautiful.
Back on topic, is the Ruckus clone an electric?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by slabo

in Kunming we have a law that forbids more than one person riding per E-bike

---

I've heard of that law in both suzhou and shanghai, but never seen it being respected or enforced. Funny that they do in Kunming.

Barnone, the Panda thanks you kindly, and yes she is.

That honda ruckus rip-off on the first page is indeed electric. All these big ebikes that you buy from custom shops were originally designed as petrol scooters. The popular models don't take long get converted to electric. The conversion isn't very difficult, stick some batteries where the petrol tank used to be and replace the engine/swingarm with a simple swingarm and in-wheel electric motor. The chinese ruckus is called a zuma (祖玛) and they have tons of customised versions here. For some reason they love making them longer too!

http://img02.taobaocdn.com/imgextra/...!!12453836.jpg

http://img02.taobaocdn.com/imgextra/...!!12453836.jpg

Hey Felix, i really like your new wheels very cool for two up around town.. you get some great looking ebikes up there.. we still haven't got past the hideous taxi ebikes and ladies shoppers with a basket on the front down in Shenzhen.
We have a law down here that allows you to have a motorbicycle with an engine up to
35cc?? any other citys have this? I see old chinese pedal bikes with tiny 2stroke motors on, delivering six 20litre water bottles or propane tanks. I'll get some pic's :lol8:
Meanwhile check out some of these old skool 40's beachbikes and board tracker motorised push bikes:eekers: it makes me want to build an old chinese delivery bike!:naughty:
http://motorbicycling.com/
cheers
Rich

Not sure about that law up here. It would be nice but i doubt it's allowed. I thought 2 strokes were banned altogether in china?

Nice site. I've thought about building one of those before. The engine kits are easily available on taobao for around 400 kuai, pick up an old postie bike for a couple of hundred and you've got a fun cheap transport. I don't think you'd get away with it for very long here in shanghai though, they must be noisy as shit.

I've written some stuff before about them over here.

Respect man. What made you decide against LPG, though? I mean I would have too but just wanna know if you considered it. Also, didn't know you live in Shanghai now! Haha...I guess that's old news seeing as it's March, but yea...cool.

Thanks of the scooter review, was good reading and good pictures.

Hi Hans, are you saying that LPG scooters don't need plates? I went for the electric scooter because i thought it was the only thing available where you don't have to deal with any legal bullcrap. Can anyone clarify what the deal is with the LPG bikes?

And actually, what is LPG? What do they run on, and what's the difference with normal scooters?


Moilami, thanks! I try to do my part to make this forum useful!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by felix

... is LPG? ...

---

Liquefied petroleum gas. Engine = petrol engine BUT moded the carb/ tank

Yea liquid propane gas. It's what like 95% of the gas scooters in Shanghai are. I think you only need to pay a couple hundred RMB to register them (don't know about foreigners though). They are slow as hell, though, and you hear stories every once in a while about the tank blowing up. But yea, they're dirt cheap. I think you made the better purchase :D

Lao Jia Hou,

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lao Jia Hou

In Beijing, we have the Beijing chapter of the Mad Dogs motorcycle club ... who have Harleys, mandatory tattoos, patches, etc. :rolleyes1: I've wondered about starting a Beijing chapter of the Happy Poodles e-scooter club, complete with lick-on tattoos, peel & stick patches, etc. One would need to be rather self-assured with one's identity to join! :lol8:

---

If you start that club, I'll join you as a member! Of course... we'll have to pick a meeting location very, very carefully so everyone can get there and still have enough juice to ride home! :lol8:

Living in Shanghai for almost 3 years, in beggining used to do my things - what involes to visit a lot of clients in diferent parts of shanghai - in a ordinary ebike, very usual, and also on my free time to have some rides with my girlfriend around bars, coffes, etc. By the time i changed to a 150cc petroleum bike what makes me so so happy, once i was free of low battery problemsand riding more than 100km for day sometimes. Came up that, once i drive without plates and license, cant get fueled up anywhere anymore, except some black market places, what still very bad, so now im lookng for an Ebike that can satisfy my needs, some ebike that can run at least 60km with one time battery charge. Problem is that i realized most of this ebikes china produce to export and its quite dificult to find good price ones in China, mostly in Shanghai. If anyone knows any seller, store or anything that can offer online please let me know... Thankssss, Neto.

Welcome to the forum, Neto.

Did you read through this eBike review thread? It has a lot of answers. Not sure it can supply miracles, though!

Yes, read it all. Theres just this kind of ebikes u can find in taobao, but not the good ones that china produces and very rarely we see in streets. I can find in alibaba website, but price is higher than 3000 dollars. Tried to find but can not, but im sure exists and someone know...hehehe...

Should be easy to track down the models that you find in Alibaba. Can you list them here, with links?

Hi Neto i just answered your question here.

my scooter was stolen this afternoon and this ost made my day! thanks richard.... hows the happy poodles club,,,, COUNT me In hahhahahaha..... i want a cute poodle tatoo hehehhehehe

@felix

That E-bike is quite a popular model and most factories make it, one of the things I do is help a company export e-bikes to columbia, and I'm actually helping develop bikes and make them make more sense... What I'm trying to say is that yes your model of bike is a pain in the arse to charge because the batteries can't be removed, I'm almost done making a modification to that model that allows you to slip the battery out and put it on one of those mini fold out trolleys so you can wheel it up to your flat. I'll post pics and instructions on how to do it when I get the chance.

Serpentza,

I'm lucky enough to live somewhere where i can charge the bike where i park it. If i couldn't do that i would never even consider one these bikes. I've had it converted to 72V which means 6 big 12Vcells, that's about 60kg of batteries. Even if they were removable and had wheels it would still be a massive pain in the arse.

Bikes like this are only to be considered if you can charge them where they stand.

All are looking nice e-bikes. A yellow-black one is more attractive than others. I want to know about it's specifications and prices.

ah, we have a new jamewatson on the forum!