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New study on the benefits of permitting motorcycles to lane split (lane "share")
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/...-everyone.html
Bikes have the same density impact in free-flowing traffic (i.e., take the same space as a car), but shine in heavy rush-hour traffic (24/7 in Beijing). This is obvious, as I can't imagine lane splitting in free-flowing traffic.
The amount of time it will take for chinese drivers and authorities to come to this conclusion could be measured in light years, if light years were a measure of time.
If only these assholes in their cars would realise that every time they see a bike, that's one less asshole in a car ruining their crawl to work. But they don't. Here's what happens to me all the time here and puts me in a blind rage:
I'm ebiking my way through stagnant traffic, trying to get through gaps and whatnot. Cardriver is stuck behind someone and hasn't moved for a few minutes. He sees me go for the gap between him and the vehicle in front him. Immediately drives forward a few more inches so there's no space for me to get through. Now i'm stuck too and i have to wait there until he can get out. Meanwhile he sits there pretending he can't see me while he's picking his teeth or spitting on the floor of his car.
Now i'm always an advocate for being calm and all that, but the amount of restraint it takes to do nothing while you're sitting there for two whole minutes beside this bone smoker who gained absolutely nothing from the whole affair, well it takes a lot of restraint.
But if i smash his lights or whatever, you can be sure the next day the forums will be filled with "foreign savage on illegal harley murders helpless old man on his way to do charity work with blind orphans"
And his is why we vent on the forum.
Felix, yeah, I know classic dickhead. We have a pedestrian crossing which is almost meaningless at the best of times, then a red light 100 meters further down. All the car and bus drivers can freaking obviously see they can't go anywhere being that there is a read light up ahead, but damn they try to block that crossing so bad, what if a cyclist/pedestrian/ebiker gets where they want to go with no cost to me? If you have the balls to point out their utter selfish BS then they get really angry and have a tantrum like a toddler. That's why they hate foreigners, because the Chinese who might have complained about that shit are a. Dead (in Cultural Revolution). b. In Ta**an c. In a metal asylum. I've been here for ten years, but I seriously doubt I'm meek and soulless enough for much longer.
A word of warning: If you hit their car they'll try to sue you for 30,000 RMB for a 30 yuan scratch, just swear/spit and be on your way. I have been thinking about bring a syringe of old brake fluid with me, which makes the car look a bit wet, barely noticeable, then the next day or two the paint falls off or stains the plastics white like semen stains. :lol8:
The traffic lights went out at a major intersection in my small town last Sunday.Unfortunately I was stuck in the madness.The complete lack of thinking other than ME ,ME,ME truly would test the patience of an angel.
Cars,buses and taxis going everywhere and I mean everywhere up the footpath, trying to go down the road the wrong way and hey when they did that they were confronted by a car coming the right(legal) way.Would the idiot who went the wrong way back up no way just sit there and stare at the other legal driver.
I had no choice but to go straight through the intersection I finally got to the lights and a bus cuts across in front of me but is blocked by an idiot who saw a small space in front of bus and tried drive through hey guess what dick head there was no clear space and he promptly stuffed everyone would he back up no way.I backed up as best I could to let the bus through but you guessed it that just gave everyone else an opportunity to ram there cars into what space they could find.
I eventually got around the bus only to find some idiot just ram his car into the space the bus left behind but was promptly stopped by all the cars stopped in front of him.If he left a gap I and everyone behind me would of got through no just another selfish Chinese driver.
I am sorry to say Euphonius I lost it an angel would of lost it.I started screaming at him and was full on the horn he did nothing when he saw me starting to get out of the car he started to move but was dumbfuc*** going forward then going back three of four times.I eventually got through.That was a painful hour.
Man I am not long for this place.Seems to me the more cars the Chinese get the worse their driving becomes.
@ bigdamo, I got a bit lost but I can see the image of chinese traffic chaos
@felix & zcm888, a flat hand hit on the trunk of the car makes a nice sounding for the person inside the car (no damage done). Just sit on your bike afterwards as if nothing happened ;)
I found a great way dealing with those idiot situations. Few weeks ago coming out of a small single lane street, 1 car already waiting at the traffic light to turn left. I go and stand left of the car leaving plenty of space for other cars to still enter the street. Just as the traffic coming from the right are about to get green light a woman in a car comes and even go stands left of me. First car coming from the right can't go further then between the woman's car and some parked car, all the other cars behind have to stop and block the junction.
Our light turns green, I turned around first and sticked a thumb up (well done), then started clapping. Afterwards drove off between the cars leaving the cagers behind!
Yeah Barry it is hard to explain the total madness of the situation.Might attach a video camera on the dash to take some videos of the madness.No one back home is going to believe me when I tell them how they drive here. :eekers:
My other friends who come to China for business just say why the hell would you want to drive in China.When I tell them I'm thinking of getting a motorcycle they say have I gone completely mad.
Yeah, Beijing traffic jam in April 2002 - almost daily for a month or so. No way for lane splitting here :eekers:
Attachment 7297
They started to put up fences in the middle of the roads all around town later that year.
Yep looks similar to the one one I was in on Sunday except the traffic jam was spread out onto the foot paths and there would of been drivers driving down that street with not many cars on it the wrong way i.e going illegally against the oncoming traffic.Quote:
Originally Posted by chinabiker
Actually that looks like my present home town minus the pollution well if you add another 50 construction cranes into that picture.
Betcha that Beijing photo don't look like that now.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigdamo
I feel for you Bigdamo.:taz:
I encountered something similar on a large city-bypass intersection just south of the city-center in Zhangdian. Huge road: 4 or 5 lanes going in each direction. It's always really busy but two months ago I noticed a huge build-up of cars ahead of me where the lights had gone out. I'd have described it almost exactly as you did.
What got me the most is that the traffic going east-west had clear roads but were completely blocked by the sh*tload of traffic going north-south. I could clearly see that straight away but it seemed like nobody else wanted to pay attention. All that the E-W traffic needed was a space large enough to get through in order to proceed to the other side but the N-S traffic barely gave enough room for motorcycles to get through. Each time a small gap appeared "BROOOMMMMM" They revved their 1.4 litre engines up and raced into it before anybody else could and where did it get them? About 80cm a minute.
Well, I was on my moto and it didn't take me long to aggressively work my way through the angry mob of metal clad Asians.
It just isn't the way forward. I'm concious of the bad habits I subconsciously pick up from others (when in Rome... can be a bad thing). At least I remember what it's like to have driven in the west and had people intentionally let me through or out of a tight spot out because they've been taught kindness and compassion. I see little of that being taught to the young ones over here.
Well since we now entered the realm of general road behavior in China I have another 2 of my cents:
I think one of the big problems is that the Chinese switched to cars basically only a decade ago. I remember quite vividly how I was sitting in the car of my parents as a child and how they told me about the right way to behave on the road. They told me about the zipper system (that is what we Germans call interweaving when two lanes in one direction merge into one), that one should give way at intersections even if it was "our" right of way just to enhance traffic flow and I noticed that being able to park a car in a tight spot in two turns is something to be proud of.
The same is not true in China. People did not grow up seeing their parents drive a car and behave politely, I am not saying that this is the main reason but it is definitely a factor.
...and there is a substantial amount of pressure on the majority of Chinese men to buy a car, for pride and face. Even if they don't want to give into this pressure they'll still need to get one before they can marry a Chinese girl.Quote:
Originally Posted by fahni
From what I've heard about China in my few years here, Fahni, you're absolutely spot on. They've not learned road manners yet, moreover, they're vehicle industry has been expanding so fast. I can't blame them, it's just this way right now and they can't do much about it.
What can we expect in the future? More of this in greater density?
What can we do? I know I SHOULD display the manners that we do in the west but when I get cut up, pushed off the road or experience any of the things here all I want to do is display my anger to the guy/girl who did it to let them know how I feel about their actions. The other Chinese people that suffer their dangerous and inconsiderate displays won't do this because they don't want the dangerous car/bike owner to loose face. If this continues, however, it leads to accidents and I don't see face being more important than life, therefore I will continue to display my anger where appropriate... for their benefit.
While I am definitely not defending the traffic insanity found in Beijing, a recent arrival told me that Beijing traffic is heaven compared to Bangkok. I don't know, as I have never been to Thailand, but he claimed that the worst of Beijing = the best of Bangkok.
But I did live in Beirut for a few years, and I can say that nothing, and I mean NOTHING, compares to the traffic madness there (Slabo ... you still there?). Beijing drivers generally stop at red lights ... Beirut drivers view red as meaning "speed up and lay on your horn." You have to experience it to believe it.
Fahni, I concur that long-term car cultures instil a basic traffic sense in kids, and that is missing here. Many locals drive cars using the same traffic principles of riding bicycles (which, btw, are not exactly perfect).
that explains it all:
http://beijingcream.com/2012/05/the-...ina-a-diagram/
Most importantly Step 11
GOLD!!!!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by andre555
************************************************** **********
In the future you can throw the RV crowd in the mix..... makes you wonder, will we ever see huge RV's like in the USA over here...???
Yangtze Delta to bet big on coming of RVs
By Hu Min | 2012-5-24 | NEWSPAPER EDITION SHANGHAI DAILY
Some 400 to 500 recreational vehicle campgrounds will be built in Shanghai and the other 20-plus cities in the Yangtze River Delta Region by the end of 2020, according to a tourism development plan.
Tourism authorities aim to turn potential consumption in the RV market into real consumer behavior by mapping out the plan, said Wang Jianming, an official with the Shanghai Tourism Administration who helped work out the scheme. The plan has passed experts' review and is expected to be officially launched in the second half of this year.
About 20 of the campgrounds will be in Shanghai, according to Wang. Most will be built in suburban areas like Songjiang, Qingpu and Jinshan districts as well as near the future Shanghai Disneyland in the Pudong New Area.
With the emergence of the market, a number of cities in China, such as Beijing and Suzhou, have already constructed campgrounds. But there is no such campground in Shanghai.
"Shortage of campgrounds and specific routes have hindered its development in Shanghai, and it still takes some time for people to receive the relatively new type of tourism concept," Wang said.
Shanghai's scarce land resources and long approval procedure are part of the reason for the shortage, he said.
Most of those who own recreational vehicles in Shanghai are business people, athletes and entertainment stars. Wang estimates the figure to be in the hundreds.
Five tourism routes specially targeting RV users will be explored, according to the scheme. They will include tours around Hangzhou Bay and Taihu Lake.
Authorities estimate that an RV tour market valued at more than 10 billion yuan (US$1.6 billion) will gradually form in China over the next decade, including 3 million to 5.5 million consumers in the Yangtze River Delta Region.
Jing Zonghua takes charge of the Shanghai branch of the CRVC (Centech RVing Club), a Beijing-based recreational vehicle seller and rental service. He said the company's business is not good in Shanghai.
"The market lacks recognition and attention in the city," Jing said.
Shanghainese are prudent about purchasing such large vehicles, and the shortage of parking spaces is a problem, he said. Vehicle prices at his firm range between 400,000 yuan and 700,000 yuan. It has six vehicles for rent but sometimes none of them is on the road.
Most campgrounds with power and water hook-ups for RVs also include facilities such as horse-riding spots and amusement parks. Jing said if developers do business only in recreational vehicle parking, they will fail. He said there is a wide range of facilities and service levels of RV campgrounds, as there is no standard in China.
In my small town red traffic lights are only for poor people to acknowledge "us rich people are not required to stop at red lights" anyways we rich people can take our plates off and break any law we like.I know I've been with them and asked them why don't they stop at red traffic lights it might be me coming through an intersection you hit next time.Answer "No we are very skilled drivers." What the F***.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lao Jia Hou
Poor people are now following said rich people.China herd like mentality.
When you sit your computer driving test there are questions relating to courtesy on the roads.Oh wait soon as they pass said test everything they have learned must be forgotten.Probably a multi choice question on that somewhere.
Oh great that's all we/they need.Oh well at least there used to not seeing anything around them.Like to see them park a RV.Quote:
Originally Posted by TB-Racing
Quote:
Originally Posted by andre555
MAGIC!!!!
Someone ought to write a book titled China, magic at work..Quote:
Originally Posted by andre555
Me too!:popcorn:Quote:
Originally Posted by bigdamo
I'm here, err, i mean there, i mean here in Beirut! Traffic is much better in Beirut now, in a sense that people won't need to speed up to cross red lights because they'd be stuck in traffic in the first place. But really, it's rare that people cross a red light now. I ride everyday, it's not so bad. My only wish is that 90% of scooters be vaporized along with their riders.. they come out of nowehere and expect everyone to give them the right of way, especially when they're going in the wrong direction.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lao Jia Hou
Beirut isn't a big city, and the average daily commute is probably about 15 km one way. Yet public transport is non-existant here. Anyone has a good estimate for peak oil production date? When will sheeple wake up?