http://www.jszmoto.com/
Has anyone heard about these guys? I heard good things from my Chinese bros, but I wanted to know your opinions. Are the papers legit with these bikes?
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http://www.jszmoto.com/
Has anyone heard about these guys? I heard good things from my Chinese bros, but I wanted to know your opinions. Are the papers legit with these bikes?
the easiest way to work out whether a motorcycle is likely to be legit (legally imported with taxes and duties paid) and therefore likely to be legally plated etc is to look at the prices asked. If the price is roughly 200% of what the same bike is new in most overseas markets e.g. USA, then you are likely looking at a genuinely imported bike. You can apply that to a second hand bike which if it is legally imported 100% will hold it's price remarkably well, up until it's about one or two years away from it's scrapage date, e.g. when it must be permanently removed from Chinese public roads and plates surrendered etc. So even a used second hand bike legally imported will cost you more than the same bike new in USA. jszmtoto are not selling legally imported bikes based on the prices I'm seeing in their ads. As for papers, they will tell you anything to get you to part with your money and then you will be on your own. Good luck with that...
You want to buy legal? Then be prepared to spend some money on anything 600cc and up. There are lots of options... <250cc and a reasonable number of options for >250cc but the latter will cost you. If you want to buy anything else then there are few if any trick ways... to be 100% legal/legit. And there are almost no ways to try and make a illegally imported bike legal, legally e.g. pay some taxes etc. after the fact.
I appreciate the prompt reply.Quote:
Originally Posted by bikerdoc
The thing is, JSZ does charge twice the price. I was on the phone with them, and the number 1 complain they get is "why are you so expensive"
For example - http://item.taobao.com/item.htm?spm=...d=12655170769&
This Hayabusa is 3.5 years old now, but costs $15,000 US. A comparable 2009 in New York would cost about $9,000. A 2012 Hayabusa costs only 14,000 brand new. So that is why I was asking. They say it's legit, comes with papers, and new bikes (if you order from them) are 200% of the price. I was just wondering if anyone went through them.
.Quote:
Originally Posted by matt999tye
Can you not get the frame number & engine number and take yourself along to the Traffic dept. and ask them?
If the bike has licence plate, take a copy of that too, but I doubt it will have a legal licence plate.
Gra.
Well I went and looked at that link to the Hayabusa. For starters it is priced at 98k, which is way under half of what it is new in China. The price for a brand new Hayabusa in mainland China is 250k plus... then add to that is Suzuki Japan have only made the Hayabusa GSX1300R available this year. I posted in the deals from dealers about the offer... so go search it out if you want the details. Even in the remotest chance that 2008 Hayabusa offered by jszmoto had been legally imported (which I would highly doubt) it would be likely be double the 98k being asked for, and then some, especially via a so called dealer. Most of the bikes being sold via Taobao are not from fully fledged bricks and mortar dealers with all the right business licenses etc. Some might have but many do not... You my friend are being feed a load of BS, and being lead up the garden path... The bikes from jszmoto might very well come with plates and documents, but there plenty of fakes, and clones around. Here's the thing, ask them, can the bike documents and bike be plated in your name, then listen for the answer? Can it be in your name, even if that means YOUR Chinese name, again listen to the answer? Can the bike be sold and plated to another persons name, what's the answer to that? Now ask them the question about getting the required registration documents along with official fapio and the second hand sales tax fapio and taking all that along to your local traffic PSB that handle vehicle registrations so that you can plate the bike in your name etc... what's their response? Ask them to supply scan copies of the registration documents so that you can go check with your local traffic PSB... see how that goes down...
Another test for ya... ask them how much for a brand new unused 2012 Hayabusa? Now compare their price to the cny250k official price...
Follow bikerdoc's & Graham's advice.
Personally, I am also 100% sure that this is 100% illegal.
Bikes that are smuggled into China are almost always stolen, or "salvage-title" bikes, commonly from Japan, Korea, USA, etc. There have been plenty of natural disasters where bikes have been written off, bought in a salvage sale, disassembled into parts, only to reappear in some back-alley shop in China, where apprentice Zhang bolts it back together with a crescent wrench & ball-peen hammer. I'd guess many of the Japan-tsunami bikes are sitting in Guangzhou and Tianjin, right next to the hot-to-the-touch models.
"Paperwork" and "plates" are very easy to get. There is also a cottage industry of changing serial numbers, which is why the Traffic Management Branch (at least in Beijing), takes a cellophane imprint of the frame & engine numbers and scans them into their computers. If you are buying a cloned bike, it is virtually impossible for the crooks to make a perfect match of the stamped numbers (the originals often do not line up). Any concern from the Traffic Police about the legitimacy of your "great deal", and they take another imprint and then check the two scans. I know this first-handed as I almost purchased one of these cloned bikes. Fortunately, my licensing agent thought it was just too good a deal, so he asked the police to check - yup, a cloned bike.
As bikerdoc notes, a legal, used Hayabusa would be 200K ... but it is highly unlikely that you're looking at a legal bike when they were not even being imported during that year.
Seriously, if these guys could really offer legal bikes for those prices, they'd be overwhelmed by the wealthy kids in Beijing.
Bikerdoc is spot on ... as he knows the answers already :naughty:.
I have been actually visiting some of these guys in those lovely Chinese fishing harbours, some years ago. There are guys there with their own private harbour and crane(s), go figure what is in those containers arriving ....
Can tell you all of their bikes are either overseas stolen bikes, insurance bikes, or crashed bikes.
Although you can never be 100% sure, I agree with LJH (in your other thread) that very most likely there is NO way to register any of these bikes officially.
Any registration will be a scam, a clone, a duplicate, a copy, or whatsoever Chinese ingenuity can come up with, but it will never be 100% official.
E.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lao Jia Hou
Damn ... 2 minutes faster ......Quote:
Originally Posted by 998S
haha - the ONLY time in my life that I can say I was faster than a Ducati! :icon10:Quote:
Originally Posted by 998S
Thanks for the great feedback. Very concise. The reason I ask is that I have been buying bikes for awhile in China, but I have always bought from friends. Another reason is that I've known at least 15 Chinese bros that swear by jsz, and we ride together. I wanted to know if anyone in the foreign community had bought from 大林。I was getting kind of disenchanted with illegal bikes after mine got jacked in Inner Mongolia. Seems the ridiculous red tape in China is made to be broken, but at the same time, it comes with a cost. As a fairly well known business owner in this city, I have enough guanxi to get out of any potential legal issue, but that doesn't save me from thieves. Maybe I'll have to give the CFmoto 650nk a whirl. That being said, if I could find a really mint Hayabusa for 200k, I would definitely consider it.Quote:
Originally Posted by bikerdoc
Thanks dudes!
My brother in law actually gets bribe offers at the port in Shenzhen for this shit all of the time. Seems to have come full circle now haha
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lao Jia Hou
There are quite a few legal options...
Qijiang/Benelli BJ600
CFMoto 650NK (650T-1) or 650TR (650T-2) and the 650T-3 adventure model using the same engine for release after CNY 2013
Loncin LX650 release sometime possibly this year or 2013. Based on the 650 single cylinder BMW inspired ROTAX engine.
Jialing JH600 two or three wheeler
Suzuki Hayabusa GSXR1300 & M10R VZR1800 (prebook orders through authorised/legit Suzuki dealerships)
Honda ST1300 (preorders through official Honda dealerships)
Harley Davidson official dealers (BJ, SH, Suzhou, Wenzhou etc) the cheapest is the 883 at around 93k plus taxes, plate etc.
BMW Motorrad stores (full range on offer, cheapest being the G650GS single without ABS)
Ducati, Benelli, Piaggio... via the official dealerships/business partners.
For links and pricing check under the deals from dealers threads...
There is also Jimmy Yu, Joy Motors in SH http://www.motogpchina.com/, that seem to be importing bikes legally (with pricing to match)...
Thanks for the site man! I'll call him for details. The Yamaha V-Max is looking tasty right now as well, or maybe that is my Chinese made lack of taste coming in after all these years haha
Quote:
Originally Posted by bikerdoc
Its complicated, there are things to consider basically a catalogue exists year on year that defines what can be imported, obviously all the models list are approved for 2012 and in that they meet all the 2012 regulations.
The question would be what about importing for personal use a used model, each year had a catalogue, so the question would be can a used motorcycle listed in that years relative catalogue be imported?
The taxes are 45% and the VAT on top of that so any imports basically are double in costs at least. So a CBR1000 could be imported maybe and a 2009 in the USA can be bought for say about $8,000.00 plus freight to get it to china add another $2,000.00, so you could theoretically get one imported maybe and exempted from being CCC approved and grandfathered in as a model year before the level 2010 III emissions.
For about $20,000.00.
This link is dated 2005, but it gives some insight into what was once possible to do and could offer some insight or at least contacts that are knowledgeable in the maters.
http://www.ccc-us.com/cccwaiver.htm
Importation of used bikes and cars are banned. as is parallel importing of anything already available in mainland China. e.g. if a bike (vehicle) model is sold here already then theoretically it cannot be imported. Prices for calculating duties and applicable taxes are not transparent, and are often based on what China customs decide something is worth, not necessarily what any invoice supplied might show. The approval process can be difficult to navigate and be time consuming. I have been waiting for the release of official documents for importing a new XT1200Z now for more than 6 months, even though I got verbal approval from the powers that be, months and months ago. It is not impossible, but it is a lengthy process and a potentially costly one too.