Crooks with balls

Very strange, very blatant activity recently on the Chinese classified ads in Beijing. One guy had three ads:

1) 2011 YBR 250 ... 2,200 rmb
2) 2010 BMW F800GS ... 2,800 rmb
3) 2011 BMW 1200GS ADV ... 2,900 rmb

Yes, those prices are accurate.

Story is "from another province and lost the paperwork" and "price is only for today because I urgently need money to get the train back home." yeah, yeah, yeah ... whatever.

My curiosity got the better of me & I got a friend to call about one, using an unregistered, unused number - the guy said he'd deliver the bike, but payment had to be via online transfer only - no cash, and no accompanying to the bank machine to get the cash.

I had zero interest in buying an obviously stolen bike, but wanted to see what would happen. I was curious if a BMW would appear, or a Jonway clone.

Anyways, sure enough, guy showed up in a couple of hours with the F800GS at a pre-arranged busy place, and also far enough away from my residence that I wasn't concerned.

F'n asshole.

But then I got thinking ... could this have been a police sting operation? Probably not, but the bank transfer thing was weird. Maybe they want a record of who actually paid for it? I can't figure that one out.

Also, I wonder how many "shops" pick these stolen bikes up for a few thousand and then resell them for oodles more, probably saying "oh, these are grey market bikes. I got them at the Tianjin market." Yeah, well, most of those TJ bikes are stolen, or rebuilt write-offs.

Very strange that it was so out in the open. Don't know why, given my time in China, but it really surprised me.

The bank transfer is weird indeed! And if it was police, shouldn't they be after people selling stolen bikes rather then people buying stolen bikes!? Well, TIC.

Damn the YBR is expensive compared to the BMW's :lol8:

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Originally Posted by Barry

Damn the YBR is expensive compared to the BMW's :lol8:

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Haha - yeah, that is what I thought too!

If I had been organized, I could've "ordered" the YBR250, just to see if mine disappeared and then reappeared. The F800 looked good, from the outside - the rider looked like a 12 year old kid.

Perhaps the kid is just a delivery boy and the big guys use his bank account to receive the money. And they've got spare keys and a gps tracker, so you might lose the bike the same day again :P

LJH, I'd suggest that there is something very likely to be associated with the guys ability (or whomsoever he represents if he is not acting alone), whereby he/they can somehow access the bank account. Sounds impossible, but some of the international scams that make the rounds work similar schemes. My question though is, why not go a step further, register for a new bank account for just this transaction, then go ahead and complete it... naturally you'd need to have the bike in your presence, or similar, and I personally would not be doing this alone. If you were successful and got to the point in the whole transaction where you had possession of the bike, then get to stripping it down in a secure place ASAP. Check it out completely for any sign of a GPS locator...

When something seems like too much of a bloody good deal, it is!!! I've just been online and checked out the price of a 2011 F800GS bronze (ABS, heated grips, very low k's) price CNY90,000 and assistance with license plate, the dealer also has a brand new 2013 F800GS striking in blue (ASC, ABS, ESA) CNY100,000. These are from a highly regarded dealer who many off the more discerning buyers and some Taobao dealers buy from. Well discerning in the sense of not buying a completely 100% legally imported bike.

Watching this one with interest and and a tub of popcorn ;)

Oh and here's a thought, one has to put the money into another account, and those of us who've been here long enough know how difficult that can be and is, even with an online account. Now, even if it can be done, I'm sure that the seller wouldn't have the bike right there as the transaction is being processed, that is even if the seller would agree to be "there". I'm sure there'd be all kinds of excuses as to why either the seller can't be there, or the bike or both. I remember a few years ago watching a youku video of a Chinese potential motorcycle buyer (made his own videologue) agree to meet a seller in another province, to pay for a bike. He took the train to the province and recorded most of his trip, the meeting with the seller, even got to see the bike, after tripping round to different places the buyer agreed to pay the seller a deposit of quite a few thousand. The seller said he needed the money to secure the bike or some such. Later the seller made some excuses, and then left the buyer at the hotel. At the agreed time the seller never showed, the buyer couldn't make contact with the seller and... well, he lost his money. At least that is how I remember the video playing out the whole scenario.

Originally, I was very surprised to see stolen bikes advertised in classifieds. I didn't believe it could be possible and that's why we "tested" it out. And, once again, my naivete was clearly demonstrated.

I think you guys are correct - the "kid" was probably just a delivery boy.

The way it was supposed to work was:

1) Bike is delivered;
2) We look it over;
3) If we want it, we transfer money through an ATM into some other account; and,
4) After the transfer is confirmed by main guy, he tells the delivery boy to leave it with us.

The "main guy" was a little pissed we "changed our mind." Truthfully, we never had any intention to buy a stolen bike - just wanted to go through the motions to see if it was "for real". I still can't believe that the crooks are brazen enough to post ads. Business must be bad, or they have an oversupply that they need to move.

The transfer was probably demanded because the "main guy" probably didn't want the delivery boy to have the cash - who knows. I think the delivery boy was surprised to see four people arrive, on our side. I'm also not sure the kid even knew what was going on.

And yeah, never thought about the GPS tracker & duplicate keys - you are probably right. It could also lead the fox directly to the hen house.

The ads pop up now and then, and usually only for a few hours. I'll try to do quick post of the next set I see.

I also wonder why they just don't flog the bikes in TJ - maybe it is getting tight there? But anyone who buys into the story of "grey imports" in that market is dreaming. I bumped into a guy, about a year ago, who sells quite a few "unplated" sport bikes. He was obviously "connected" into the underground market, and he openly stated that he would be very surprised to see a bike in TJ that hadn't been stolen, either within China or Hong Kong or Japan, or wherever. Or maybe he was just telling me that to keep me in Beijing, and not go to TJ? Who knows.

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Originally Posted by Lao Jia Hou

But anyone who buys into the story of "grey imports" in that market is dreaming. I bumped into a guy, about a year ago, who sells quite a few "unplated" sport bikes. He was obviously "connected" into the underground market, and he openly stated that he would be very surprised to see a bike in TJ that hadn't been stolen, either within China or Hong Kong or Japan, or wherever.

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many years ago we had 2-3 bike shops in Shanghai with constantly updated photo albums of bikes "available" in various countries and they could bring them in within a month.
bikes shown on the pics had HK, JPN, AUS license plates and were stolen to order..... in case you were not satisfied with the bike selection available they would look for bikes that might suit you and your wallet.... TIC, go figure!

won't be surprised its still the case nowadays with some fly by night operators claiming to import via grey channels from some countries in the Asia / Pacific region and that includes brand-new crated bikes as well.

If it SEEMS to good to be true (then !!) its toooo gooood to be true.

not getting at anyone just sayin

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Originally Posted by Robeta

If it SEEMS to good to be true (then !!) its toooo gooood to be true.

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Definitely true. It was obvious the bikes had questionable origin. One of my all-time favorite MCM quotes comes from Euphonius ...

"It is a 'one-owner bike' ... although that owner doesn't know where it is"

The ads are back - a couple of YBR 250s (one red, one grey) from this morning:

Attachment 12508

Attachment 12509

Prices have also gone up!

Sometimes 58.com will have a legitimate bike on there but for the most part it is crooks and liars. I was tempted a year ago by a CBR 1000 but thankfully my common sense kicked in after my secretary told me about the bank transfer part. Regardless, used bikes cannot be legally registered, so unless you're looking for a track bike it's just as well to avoid the site altogether.

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Originally Posted by Nuhaus

Sometimes 58.com will have a legitimate bike on there but for the most part it is crooks and liars.

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So true - it is like the Craigslist of China. But sometimes, hidden in that pile of crap, is a gem. I just bought/transferred a bike today, from 58.com. But damn, one has to be really careful.

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Originally Posted by Nuhaus

I was tempted a year ago by a CBR 1000 but thankfully my common sense kicked in after my secretary told me about the bank transfer part. Regardless, used bikes cannot be legally registered, so unless you're looking for a track bike it's just as well to avoid the site altogether.

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Unfortunately, in Beijing, several of the "dealers" are actually "stealers" ... so I try to find <6 month, <2K kms bikes on 58.com/weifengtang, ganji, etc. They come up, but a person has to be quick, cash in hand. I've been waiting a long time for the 650TR ... it'll come ... it'll come. But got a couple of gems this past month. I've also learned the ins/outs of plate/registration transfers, so I can usually complete a deal within 24 hours.

But you're right ... there is so much crap on 58.com

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Originally Posted by Lao Jia Hou

So true - it is like the Craigslist of China. But sometimes, hidden in that pile of crap, is a gem. I just bought/transferred a bike today, from 58.com. But damn, one has to be really careful.

Unfortunately, in Beijing, several of the "dealers" are actually "stealers" ... so I try to find <6 month, <2K kms bikes on 58.com/weifengtang, ganji, etc. They come up, but a person has to be quick, cash in hand. I've been waiting a long time for the 650TR ... it'll come ... it'll come. But got a couple of gems this past month. I've also learned the ins/outs of plate/registration transfers, so I can usually complete a deal within 24 hours.

But you're right ... there is so much crap on 58.com

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Agree 100%

You might like the 650TR there LJH, as there are many things to like IMO.

Positives: Decent power 75HP, 212kg (not anywhere near as heavy as my Dragstar 1100 or Burgman 650), 6 speed gearbox, light clutch, not too grabby from the get-go. Has a nice throaty burbly sound from the standard exhaust, which tucks to the right nicely. Standard lights are pretty decent, though on low beam only the RHS light is on. I like the ability though to have control over the lights off/on, and the inclusion of LEDs though they could be AUDI bright. Fairing provides some protection from the elements. Mirrors actually work in their location, though having the ability to fold the pods would have been better than just having pop off pods. Inclusion of hazard lights is a plus. Lockable panniers and the little stow-away bins in the front fairing are a worthwhile concept, though omission of a power source (e.g. cigarette lighter) up front is a missed opportunity for little cost ex-factory.

Detractors: I find that the seat canters forward a little pushing one into the tank. The seat itself has more padding toward the rear section of the riders portion of the seat, as does the pillion section. In any other jurisdiction I'd get the seat redone, but being that TIC I'll leave it for now. Overall the 650TR is a pretty decent first attempt. Fit and finish is pretty okay, but there are some wants on my list for the 650TR. The side stand needs to be longer, being that it is too short and thus the bike has a fair amount of lean when placed onto the side stand. I'm having my side stand lengthened. The omission of the centre-stand is a piss-poor oversight IMO. What this means, with the bike on the side-stand leaning to far over to the LHS placing anything into the LHS pannier is made just that more complicated, given that the panniers don't come supplied with any type of internal luggage restraining hardware. The dash dials and LCD provide basic info. There's no trip meter functionality, no clock - again real oversights. The front screen needs some adjust-ability, to get the wind from the chest to up and over the helmet IMO. As it is, the air quality leaving a lot to be desired in many parts of PRC means that not having a adjustable screen results in bad air and everything that it contains hitting ones face/eyes. I've already added/packed in washers under the top fasteners of the screen raising the top edge about 1cm. Have ordered some longer 6mm replacement bolts to go even higher.

As is typical, IMO, it's the little details that have been missed - which is a shame, since most everything else is fairly decent, and only detract from what would be more than a good bike for TIC.

Didn't mean to railroad the thread; - planning to get round to a 650TR review of a similar style as the one on the Jetmax I did back in 2010. Just thought you might like the insights LJH.

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Originally Posted by bikerdoc

Didn't mean to railroad the thread; - planning to get round to a 650TR review of a similar style as the one on the Jetmax I did back in 2010. Just thought you might like the insights LJH.

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Greatly appreciated - I've been reading anything / everything about these bikes. They seem not bad. Looking forward to your own review!

Beijing police set up a sting operation, and netted three crooks ...

http://attachments.motorfans.com.cn/...3wirYy3298.jpg

Full story here (linkie). By the way, what's with the "no handcuffs" but shoes removed? :lol8: