What moto do you recommend for the crappy roads in china? thinking about the smoothness of most road bikes but they tend not to be good on rough roads. willing to spend 30K RMB or less
thanks for the input!!:riding:
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What moto do you recommend for the crappy roads in china? thinking about the smoothness of most road bikes but they tend not to be good on rough roads. willing to spend 30K RMB or less
thanks for the input!!:riding:
Hey. I actually just asked this question in the dual sport thread. The answers are there but here is the tldr:
1. Buy a Japanese bike made in China. The YBR250 is the usual recommendation.
2. If you really want a China bike, you have three options >250cc and many options <250cc.
3. Larger than 250cc, look at jialing JH600 (sport touring), Shineray x5 (adv dual purpose), or a CFMoto650NK (street)
4. At 250cc, you have a large assortment of utilitarian dual purpose bikes with few features and many cheap parts. Worth mentioning is the Zongshen Rx3.
information, dealers and prices can be found at http://www.newmotor.com.cn/
Thanks for the input.. And good site recommendation.Quote:
Originally Posted by cryptographicide
I have seen the Ybr and it didn't have rear disc...
Zongshen looks good but doesn't feel refine when driving.
The Suzuki 250 is smooth but sucks off road or rough road and seat pushes passenger into driver making driving difficult
:taz:
I guess I should correct myself. I forgot the Benelli brand. But I'm not sure where they fall. Made in China? Designed elsewhere? Can someone answer maybe?Quote:
Originally Posted by cryptographicide
Benelli made in china seems popular and i see it in many places....but its a road bike and puts passenger up above the driver a bit. good price.. 600 is 40k rmb and they have a 300 that is 24K. big fat ass rear tire on the 600...this bike is bought by many chinese that want to show off....but it is good looking 42k will get you the european looking one!Quote:
Originally Posted by cryptographicide
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For 30,000 and touring as has been already mentioned the JH600 is a popular bike. Many people have claimed reliability with this bike, and I believe them, maybe down to luck, although others are not fans. I'm kind of on the fence with the bike. Possibly one of the better Chinabike options, with a higher devlopment budget due to military orders, plus its been around a while, long enough to iron out some of the problems, a big maybe especially if you can find a well looked after 2nd hand one. Chinabike, so deprication and deterioration will be fast.
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Qingqi have a Suzuki joint venture and all their bikes have Suzuki derived engines. Their QM250GY 'Liger' seems like it might do the job within your budget. A true road trail bike, however its not Suzuki badged so deprication will be fast and assembly quality is questionable. I have heard the exported ones do corrode quickly in wet weather.
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Benelli BN600. To me it seems like likely a fun budget track bike and for can't ride posers who want a Ducati on the cheap for gaining face, but it's high on your budget and being a fairly low slung liquid cooled inline four nasty roads are surely going to upset it. Its been deisned by Italians, and assembled by Chinese, with Chinese management calling the shots, you can't really call it a joint venture bike. If only it had been a triple. If its not immaculate when selling it 2nd hand (to some show off) I think you'd struggle to sell it. In essence a Chinabike so deprication and deterioration will be fast.
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Benelli 600GT. It's got better clearance than a BN600 but its clealy an ugly heavy inline four so its just a tourer, and price will be up around 50,000 so not a great idea.
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Benelli BN302. Has a fairly powerful for its size liquid cooled twin that is obviously designed to take on the Ninja 300. Looks like it will one of the better road bikes off-road with the right shoes. There are some poistive views, but longer term who knows?
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CFMOTO 650NK or TR. Its a bit more meat and potatoes than the Benelli BN600 and copied from a proven Kawasaki ER6N design and being a 60hp liquid cooled twin. Some intermediate tires could see it being capable enough on some poorer roads, but it would still struggle with anything really rough, but its the high end of your budget at 37,000. Again its a Chinabike so deprication and deterioration will be fast.
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KTM Duke 390. assembled by CFMOTO in China. This is out of your price range at 50,000, but it needs a mentioned as it's actually a lot of bike for the money. Neutral riding position, and a powerful single for its size, thinking of resale, toughness and other factors with intermmediate road trail tires it might be a very capable machine for all but the roughest stuff. If only it was 40,000, it would sell like hot cakes. To most peoples thinking 50,000 is a bit rich for a bike assembled here.
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Haojue Suzuki GW250. A water cooled low-slung and very heavy for its size. To me it just looks wrong. It's well within your budget at 24,500, and probably very reliable. However many sub-par roads will be no-goes even with road/trail rubber. Will likely perform better than average in retaining its value.
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Jianshe Yamaha YBR250. 24,500 yuan. Proven relaible, but its still a budget single cylinder commuter, with cheap forks and a rear drum. But then again I'd rather have a Yamaha drum brake than a cheap underperforming Chinese disk brake with wooden brake pads. Neutral riding position and air cooling means throwing on some road trail tires means it could could just about go anywhere. It might be worth something when you come to sell it too.
Zongshen, Shineray, Galaxy and a few others.... Some of these companies make some interesting looking bikes and some of them road trail offerings over 250cc, worth a look, but obviously, assembly, reliability, deterioration and depriciation will most likely hurt you in the short and long run. Personally I'd rather buy better assembled road bike and put some road/trail tires and boxes on it than play Russian Roulette with a most Chinabikes.
ZMC888. EXCELLENT report
Here lies the problem.. So many seemingly good bikes but most have multiple draw backs.
Two years ago I visited and bought a Galaxy 250,, one would think a foreigner visting their factory and buying a motorcycle there would think thay would give a well inspected bike! It had multiple problems..more rhan 10,,, first month and bad build quality. Furthermore they never responded to my efforts to contact them.
So yes Im cautious buying now. overall it reads as... Go with a road bike because quality likely better and add better suited tires
Thanks again
:thumbsup:
My own choices are as follows:
1. Best quality available without selling my apartment: Honda CB500F 70,000. Or wait for CB500X next year.
2. Most logical bike to match terrain (not thinking about quality): Jialing JH600
3. Best bike under 50,000: KTM Duke 390
4. Best bike under 25,000 Jianshe Yamaha YBR250
Remember these are just opinions....
If you have already been burnt by a sub-standard Chinabike I would buy a Jianshe Yamaha YBR250 and then copy the YBR125KG as a template.
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and buy some parts on Taobao.
the difference only being the tires and hand guards?Quote:
Originally Posted by ZMC888
....and some extra mud clearance on the front fender and a mini wind screen plus a guard, then some luggage racks and hard cases if needed for touring. It is a bit tricky to find suitable good quality front tire in road trail form.Quote:
Originally Posted by kikikillercat
China V also bought a Galaxy 250 and said he wished he'd bought a YBR250 instead.
German cars, Japs bikes, … girls (cough, I am not the right person to say this).
No dude. Italian cars, German beer, British bikes and Swedish women.....but I'm too poor to afford them all. :naughty:Quote:
Originally Posted by td_ref
American cars instead of Italian ones, the rest sounds about right :icon10:Quote:
Originally Posted by ZMC888
Going back to KTM Duke 390, Ive watched couple of videos on youtube about it and there is one made by guy fro India who says it costs a little more than half of European price. I was shocked so I checked and it costs about 187000rupee which is below 19000RMB. In Europe it costs about 5500Euros which is about 42000RMB
I thought there is no high tax on bikes made/assembled here
What the hell China??
I discussed this elsewhere in MCM...
...the MSRP for the Dukes made in India is about a third of the MSRP in PRC. Me thinks this is related to the Dukes being assembled from CKD kits imported from the Indian factory, which likely results in still 30-40% [ASEAN] import duties and taxes, rather than a truly wholly manufactured PRC bike. Just a guess...
40,000 is fair, and for that price they'd sell a lot. I think parts are taxed at 20% when imported.Quote:
Originally Posted by bikerdoc
50,000 is just too much. I think some people are getting greedy for scared. Someone probably thinks that KTM are a 'premium European product like BMW' and want the price to reflect that. Or they are worried that at 40,000 they would kill off much of the demand for the 650NK, BN600 etc.
However if it's made in India and assembled in China I struggle to see the 'premiumness'. Even though 20,000 more a Thai made Honda CB500 is probably better value, as its going to be better manufactured and better assembled.
I agree wholeheartedly to some extent - not sure about the extent to which various components attract duties and taxes etc. Some might argue that an Austrian brand is still a premium brand (not necessarily a luxury brand), despite where it is built, and the price reflects that. I don't necessarily agree with that, but some premium and luxury brands have discovered that when 'they' entered the PRC market, products did not meet sales forecasts. This left these companies scratching their marketing dept. heads - why?Quote:
Originally Posted by ZMC888
When some potential consumers were asked why by market analysts ... the brands in question discovered that the locals perception was one of perceived value perception vs. price sensitivity. Upshot being that prices were seen as soft (set too low), and once the luxury brands responded by repositioning prices for the intended market (more expensive) sales increased exponentially. Those sluggish sales very quickly increased beyond sales targets initially set.
Most of us will know of these luxury brands...
TIC! - LFZ!
Anecdotally the KTM-CFMoto Duke390 is selling very very well - if the info I have been provided is to be believed. Supposedly just the volume sold through a newer Hangzhou store has seen supply unable to keep pace with demand. CFMoto (KTM) cannot keep up with demand - is my understanding. But who knows... smoke and mirrors, and all that jazz...
As always I'm analyzing what bike I want next, and realistically that's every three years, and my bike is only a year old, but it's still nice to stay up to date with the things that are happening as it can keep my opinions valid. I'm quite a greenie so if I lived in my home country I think I'd have a Zero SR or something like it for commuting, but when the prices could drop a bit lower in a few years. Then if I could afford it something like a Triumph Daytona or CBR600F for track and various other kinds of riding, quite easy choices.Quote:
Originally Posted by bikerdoc
However in restricted China things get complicated. I really would be torn between the KTM Duke 390 and Honda CB500F right now if I were buying again. Actually the KTM might win, just because of the more attainable lower price, but being made in India and assembled in China it really does some leave some scope for worry. Sure you'd get a warranty, however it is somewhat likely you might need at some point to claim on it with all the annoyance and frustration that can entail, this is really much less likely with a Thai made Honda IMO.
^similar thought process ZMC888.
I'd have a Zero DS or if someone did a maxi e-scoot I'd be a potential customer if the prices were realistic, and there were better range offerings - range anxiety is more than just an emotion but a reality as I discovered having owned several e-scoots here over the years. I've been known to push previously owned ranges of e-scoots. I've had to call on the services of the local Suzuki dealer to come collect me and my 'flat' e-scoots in their Ford Transit, in days past.
As for the petrol moto offerings, with the Thai manufactured KLE650 (Versys) offering at 83500, and the likely availability of the Thailand manufactured Honda CB500X... maybe these will help just the push of the local market flood gates most of us wish for (fingers croxxed).
To my mind the locally manufacured moto's offer few attractions other than supposed part affordability and availability - and even sometimes these are mere concepts than a reality.
what is the best for the money etc.... big price difference,,, the Jialing 223 is 13800, Yamaha 250 is 23000:
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Jialing has rear disc, whereas the Yamaha doesnt...which isnt a deal breaker at this weight.
Input appreciated..........
This is a bit of a curve ball. There's advertising it's a 230cc, a 223cc, a 250cc and a 200cc. Obviously it's really a 223cc single and being Jialing it could be an engine taken from Honda genuine blueprints, as I believe Honda do have one in this size adn Jialing have a joint venture with Honda for generators and other household products. Also Jialing have a solid reputation as far as Chinabikes go, and price is very tempting, saving 10,000 is a fair bit of money. If these are exported and there are good reviews, then put it on the maybe list, but remember being 223cc it's 3KW down on the YBR250, and each kw at this engine size makes a big difference, and that's where some of the price difference has gone.
Also another point in favor of a drum brake on the rear of a small bike is that it is protected from mud, dust and water at least partially. Dirty roads with cheap pads and disks can often lead to pad and disk contamination or sometimes rub.