hi from Germany

I say hello from Germany!
I am a passionate motorcycle rider (at the moment I ride an Aprilia RSV 4 and a Ducati Scrambler) and interested in all kind of motorsports. Fortunately I can combine this passion with my job, as the company I work for has several clients out of the motorcycle business.
Furthermore I am quite linked to China as my wife is Chinese and we are planning to move to China with our little daughter within the coming years.
So riding motorcycles, working also in the motorcycle business and in privat life being linked to China, I am really happy that I found this forum in order to get a better idea of what is going on in China under a motorcyclist point of view.

Thanks for being part of this forum!

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Originally Posted by trackaddict

I say hello from Germany!
I am a passionate motorcycle rider (at the moment I ride an Aprilia RSV 4 and a Ducati Scrambler) and interested in all kind of motorsports. Fortunately I can combine this passion with my job, as the company I work for has several clients out of the motorcycle business.
Furthermore I am quite linked to China as my wife is Chinese and we are planning to move to China with our little daughter within the coming years.
So riding motorcycles, working also in the motorcycle business and in privat life being linked to China, I am really happy that I found this forum in order to get a better idea of what is going on in China under a motorcyclist point of view.

Thanks for being part of this forum!

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Welcome to the forum!

There are some difficulties to overcome such as getting a Chinese motorcycle license and buying a registered bike, as well as adapting to the driving 'style'. It's all on here, browse the forum.

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Originally Posted by ZMC888

Welcome to the forum!
There are some difficulties to overcome such as getting a Chinese motorcycle license and buying a registered bike, as well as adapting to the driving 'style'. It's all on here, browse the forum.

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Thanks for the welcome!

Yes, I can imagine. I once had been to a dealership in Beijing where official bikes were sold. Just beside there had been another shop (apparently same owner), where illegal Japanese bikes (with no numberplates) coming in through Hongkong were offered. Weird... :confused1:

Regarding traffic, I saw quite a strange riding style of scooter riders and also no respect towards them from the car drivers. I hope Cinese car drivers have some more concern for "real" bikers...

Oh, any questions, please ask.

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Originally Posted by ZMC888

Oh, any questions, please ask.

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Many thanks!
I surely have a lot of questions also in sight of my next trip to China (normally I go to Beijing and Liaoning). E.g. if there are big biker hangouts like in Europe (e.g. Boxhill and many others in UK, Germany and other, mainly Northern European countries), if there are any open trackdays organized on the more well known race tracks (what's about Shanghai Circuit?), if there is the possibility of renting motorcycles,and much more.

However, these days I will start to read a bit through the forum in order to avoid questions which already had been asked many times.

G'Day, welcome to MCM.
Sounds like you're reasonably informed. That's a bonus. The issues surrounding motorcycling and motorcycles has changed little since your experiences, though there are more legal middle-big displacement bikes available.

But, I've got to ask, why? Why come to PRC? I'm not meaning to sound all pessimistic, but...

It's one thing to visit the country on vacation or stay on a short term work contract, but to live here full time... and with a child? Sorry, I maybe in a minority here, but this is not a place to come and raise a child. Why? Well for one thing there's little to no control over supply chains in many aspects that we all rely on for daily living here. QA and QC are mere tokenisms by many, in fields where it counts. To maintain a quality of life in day to day life here is expensive. Imported products cost more since the PRC Govt. takes a good slice of the pie. Education for your daughter will either be expensive via one of the international schools or left wanting on many fronts if she's enrolled in a local/experimental school. IMHO if you want an Asian experience, move some place else like HK, Thailand, Singapore or one of the other SEA nations. They all offer far better quality of life IMO. From a motorcycling point of view, PRC sucks for the whole motorcycling ownership experience.

Moving elsewhere other than PRC - you and your families mind, body and health will be the benefactors. The motorcycle ownership and whole riding situation is far more positive. Northern Thailand has motorcycle clubs, organised rides and whole lot more going on. Motorcycles are not relegated to the fringes as is often the case here. The local people in Thailand drive 100 times better than here and are way more aware on the whole too in my experience.

PRC has a label as a developing country for good reason. The country might have multi-lane roadways, plenty of luxury this and that, ever increasing number of sky scrapers and what not, but "Everything here is just for looking - if you scratch beneath the veneer, for nothing is as it seems, beAware the smoke and mirrors," - apply this literally to EVERYTHING here. Incompetency and complacency rule.

YMMV.

Thanks for your long post, bikerdoc!

Wow, hard words about living in China!
I do not have the intention to emigrate to China, but I would like to live over there for at least some years (my Chinese wife likes that idea even more... - not so our 3-year old daughter :icon10:)
There are several private and also business related reasons for it. But for sure I will not say bye bye to Europe (also because apart from my home country, I really love countries like Italy and Spain). Anyway, this is all still future music.

Regarding the traffic yes, it is quite scaring to see certain things on the web and also when I am there.
Interesting that there are now more motorcycles around; I also saw some sales figures regarding the Chinese market from the European manufacturers. Not "exploding", but increasing.

Thanks again for your concern!

Welcome!
When you have questions feel free to ask after reading the related posts in the forum.
(The search is a pain i. t. a. but you will figure that out :-) )

... just few things to say:
a) nowadays stay legal regarding bikes and license
b) in the Chinese traffic food chain you are just 1 level above pedestrians (Large trucks are level 5 :naughty:)
c) forget your German thinking for "the right of the way" or "each others care in traffic" (here they give a shit on this)
d) ride with mental radar scanner (never look around whats aside the road .... oh a XY shop ..... (potentially) BANG!!!)
e) keep all vehicles left, right & front of you on your radar ( ... wonder only if they follow the rules)
f) accept that in accident case no one might help you (but foreigners)
g) get a WeChat account to join the riders communities
h) .... nevertheless enjoy a f... great riding experience with less limits and a wonderful international riders community

feel free to PM me in German

Cheers!

Yes there are some great racetracks called Sichuan and Yunnan. Thousands of corners but no flag marshals and no ambulance. As for bringing a kid here. What bikerdoc said.

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Originally Posted by zhu

Yes there are some great racetracks called Sichuan and Yunnan.

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Sorry for being impatient , but too curious about it...
Is there any sort of organized or open trackdays for motorcycles in China? What is about Shanghai circuit - on the web I saw pics of track days for cars of some years ago, but nothing more. Are there any other race tracks around China where people can go with their bike (or at least car) and where you have maybe even sort of smaller competitions?

I live in Chengdu so only sure about here. There is a local series of car/bike days which are races and also some trackdays which are just hoon around days . But it is a rich mans sport here. Shanghai has track days at the old circuit Tianma which is a bit dodgy according to some . I used to ride street circuits in Nz ,places like Wanganui and Nelson and those tracks are lined with power poles and concrete walls , so the tracks in China seem ok to me.

If you get out into the countryside in Yunnan its just winding empty roads and free to ride with no cops so...

Tianma circuit in SHangers had track days on a schedule cars and bikes. Cars more predominantly. BMW does the driver experience training there (or at least did). One of the tuning garages at Tianma was run by a foreign car guru. He and his associates were running a sort of budget class deal, where one could buy a Ch!nese branded small compact car (forget the brand) which the garage would prepare - remove all non-essential items, replace seats with racing set, 5 point harness and roll cage plus a whole host of other essentials for racing. Cannot recall if they touched the motor or not (it was many years ago - maybe 4-5 years back). One could buy the car outright or go shares in a car with others. The deal was organised through that garage, so I don't think one could just go buy any small compact car and join in that category. AFAIK for bikes, not a lot going on at Tianma track these days compared to before, though I'm not in that loop any more so who knows.
The main motorcycle track is Zhuhai... If you are interested in racing then BG Performance are the outfit to contact.
As stated racing is not a poor man's game especially in PRC.

The passing comment about racing in Yunnan and Sichuan was a little in jest (tongue in cheek). Meaning that there are so many mountains and mountain roads with very little police and enforcement, therefore the suggestion was you could ride through those provinces as though you were riding on a race track. However, no guarantees.

HaHa no guarantees at all !

Great! I very much appreciate all the info, thanks a lot!!

Is on Shanghai International circuit going on something also for motorbikes, or is it just a car circuit? Seems to be a very nice track, but very poor info on the web.
And what is about the Northern part of China, or is all the "music" playing in the South?

Shanghai circuit is like any other nice sporting facility in China. Locked and closely guarded least any peasant should wear it out.

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Originally Posted by zhu

Shanghai circuit is like any other nice sporting facility in China. Locked and closely guarded least any peasant should wear it out.

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Interesting!

Tomorrow I will have the pleasure to go to Mugello circuit in order to test an application for bikes. So for a week I will start surfing a bit around here and then afterwards hop into some threads.

Thanks so much for the kind welcome and also for the information already given in this welcome thread!

We have a local circuit in Shandong, small but nice layout. Seems cars rule, car drivers have money and the track is over-subscribed as most of the local governments are under strict orders not to waste land and anything fun like a golf course or race track is seen as a waste, so sometimes cities with 3-10 million residents don't have any sort of local circuit so there is a large catchment area and waiting list for often low-skill wealthy show-off sports car drivers to get on the track. Being China many drivers love to show off hate to lose face and are sometimes attending a track day to make connections and network as much as it is a hobby. Marshaling and circuit healthcare are very poor or non-existent, so it is likely to find dirt, fluids and other debris on the track. I'm sure there is space for motorcycle riders to get on to the circuit at non-peak times, not sure though why we haven't heard of anything, maybe there is noting much going on or it's a closed group or the prices too high.

http://www.pinkbike.com/video/381733/

I edited my previous post in this thread. As far as the former 'Shangers' F1 circuit, bikes don't race there since the F1 circuit lost the MotoGP hosting rights. Tianma is the circuit that is used for motorcycle track days in SH. There used to a fairly good motorcycle presence at Tianma back about 5+ years ago. Tianma even had a German motorcycle engineer who had a lot of design skills (he'd had a lot to do with BMW back in the day and was the fundamental design engineer on the BMW suspension system so prevalent today in BMW motorcycles. He had his own shop focused on wrenching etc at Tianma back then, as well as heavily involved in the race cart scene. I posted about the engineer/shop years ago somewhere here on MCM. Over time though, the German engineer closed shop and moved out. Subsequently several other motorcycle related shops also shut/moved from Tianma. My last visit to Tianma last year (when I went to SH BMW Motorrad to buy my GS in August 2014), there was only one motorcycle shop remaining. Everything else at Tianma was car related.

ZMC888 reply, reminded me that there is a private track just on the southern outskirts of Chiang Rai. Yep, not PRC. The Chiang Rai circuit is small, but made to a high spec and it is for motorcycles only! The track is fairly well attended. Forget how much it costs to rent the track for a half/full day. The owner is a wealthy Thai guy, who just happens to love motorcycles/motorcycling, so he built a track for the local motorcycling fraternity/community. I've got some photos I took this past Jan-Feb 2015, of the track somewhere - if I locate them I'll post them to this thread. Notwithstanding that BKK has a full sized MotoGP spec track. As previously mentioned, Thailand is way more motorcycle friendly than the middle kingdo0m in my experience.

YMMV

Hi,

To make it short and compact...

1. I live in Beijing and ride a 600 Benelli
2. There is a race track in Beijing called "Golden Port" racetrack where motorcycle events happen from time to time.
3. Buy a Ducati from Ducati Beijing, join the DOC Beijing and you will be part of such events. Though they are not cheap and rarely good drivers are there. Most of them have a max ankle during cornering of 15 degrees and 30kmh... But nice bikes with all carbon equipment you can imagine
4. You need a license to drive so make sure you mention that during your car driving test. Then they will mention it in your local license as well.
5. As a foreigner you can't register a bike on your own due to whatever reason. So the bike owner need to be a Chinese or a Chinese company. Legally you are then not the owner of the bike, but no risk no fun.
6. Beijing mountains are beautiful and have curves you hardly find in Germany... And since Chinese car drivers don't like curves, roads are more or less empty and you can burn tires...
7. don't have a accident in the mountains, as you will die there. No one will touch you or pick you up. So I recommend to have always some spare mm while riding.
8. I can sell you my very loud bike next year in June of you wish... Will go back to Germany and enjoy my Duc then...
9. Before you think on motorcycling in Germany come over here.... ;-) settling down will take at least a year before you even can think about motorcycles in China.
10. More and more bikers are seen in Beijing. Most of them are riding in t shirt with a Wollmütze zur Sicherheit... Haha enjoy!

Send me a pn if you wanna know more....

Foreigners can normally register a bike in BI in their name with a Beijing A plate (about 100k RMB for the plate only)
Beijing B plates can be registered to chinese citizens with residence registration out of 4th ring road.
(about 3k RMB)
Many foreigners use the bike shop where they bought the bike as owners to get a B plate.
You may register under your chinese wifes name.

First of all welcome to all new comers from my side. Although I am also new here and just start posting. So,hi to all and I am sure it will be a great time for me to talke with you all buddies.

I am sorry to come back so late to this forum in order to say thank you for all the info and in particular to German "Mr. Wollmütze" :icon10:
Together with some other people I was hanging around a bit on various race tracks in Europe in order to test a mobile application (maybe I will open a thread on it, as it is quite fun), so forum time was short.
Now I am back again but in Germany and not yet living in fascinating China :rolleyes1: