Loncin the second largest motorcycle manufacturer in China, dropped 12.6% in production for the first half of 2012. It is responding with improved offerings, Loncin is number two in china in total production and also number one in its global exports, it sold 55% of its production domestically and exported 45% YTD 2012.
I'll be damned! Could this be yet another mid-displacement choice in China??!! And I think we can safely conclude from the photo that this will be powered by some variant of the 650cc thumper that Loncin now supply to BMW for the G650GS (not to be confused with the F650GS, which is a twin that actually displaces 800cc).
Qili Motors in Beijing has apparently been accepting deposits since early November, 2012, based on a price of 43,800. No word on delivery date.
12-13-2012, 10:17 AM
SabineHartmann
Re: Loncin 重庆隆鑫机车有限公司
I tried to find LX650 on the manufacturer site. Failed
12-13-2012, 01:56 PM
bikerdoc
Re: Loncin 重庆隆鑫机车有限公司
Sabine, the LX650 is based on the ROTAX BMW engine, in fact it is probably safe to say that it is a copy of that engine... I posted about the LX650 last year and earlier this year in several threads including the one about the legal bikes post the new China Emission 3 standards...
I still feel though Sabine it is better for you to wait until the CFmoto 650 twin cylinder adventurer/dual purpose bike is released after the Chinese New Year 2013... which will be better suited to a majority of the riding surfaces inside China. I am waiting on it myself.
12-13-2012, 02:01 PM
bikerdoc
Re: Loncin 重庆隆鑫机车有限公司
Just another thought though, is that the BMW G650GS with that ROTAX single cylinder engine, without ABS is around the RMB100,000 price tag, so actually even though it is still expensive comparatively speaking, it is still cheaper than the same model with ABS which is another RMB30,000+ more expensive. Either way, it'd be legal, and quite a more saleable bike should one be wanting to sell it on after a few years of ownership without a significant loss IMO, since there are few LEGAL second hand ones for sale at any given time. YMMV
Who can buy the bike in China? It is not affordable to most people in China, the areas where motorcycles can be ridden are outside of the areas where people earn enough to buy them. That’s my perception of marketability.
Seems that they need to have A plates in all the areas that banned motorcycles, they could add A plates to all those cities and in that dealers that sell all the Chinese manufactured bigger bikes. Seems to me the only way to ensure that these new offerings actually succeed is also ensure that they have a market, that is to make sure that people that can afford them can own them.
But do not expect that to happen, it is not the national government banning motorcycles it’s the provincial governments that are banning bikes. The two areas that have A plates are national Shanghai and Beijing are administered by the national government.
If the provincial governments do not allow the registration and titling of these new offerings in cities where people have the incomes to buy them, then the sales of these will never be realized, not in any quantity.
12-13-2012, 04:38 PM
bikerdoc
Re: Loncin 重庆隆鑫机车有限公司
Actually it is the city governments that legislate and effectively ban motorcycles from the cities. No amount of postulating or otherwise about the reason, logic, intent or validity about such bans on this type of website will make one i-ota of difference, unfortunately. Also those Chinese that have money, won't be interested in these mid sized displacement bikes (though they are large displacement to the vast majority of Chinese who know little else) unless said motorcycles are part of a JV and/or carry a foreign manufacturers name. This is where Benelli and QiJiang with the BJ600/QJ600 have undoubtedly been rather successful since there is a nice Benelli badge on the tank. Most affluent Chinese though who have deep pockets and want the best are really not interested in anything from a JV or made inside mainland China bike and definitely not one made from a Chinese manufacturer thank you very much (who can blame them). There is a certain level of discrimination against any product of this nature which is made inside China compared with the same product imported from abroad, the latter of which is the more desirable of the two. It is why BMW, HD et al. are doing so well despite the high entry fee. If the range of models from either manufacturer were made inside China their desirability would suffer despite the lower entry fee.
True story. Did this research as part of my eMBA I did several years ago in Shanghai. An exclusive luxury brand entered China's luxury retail space, opening an exclusive invite only store in Shanghai. They had plenty of potential customers in the store, exclusive with invite only who attended, but sales were sluggish. The luxury brand didn't understand why, after all they had reviewed the market, thought and assumed the knew the potential customers habits. Selected what the company thought were acceptable price points. Didn't sell the quantities forecast. Sales fell short of projections. Company scratched their heads. Why?
The company hired an external market research company to find out where the company was going wrong. Were the products not right for the market place? No. Was there demand for the product range? Yes. Were the products desirable? Ye. Were the price points too high? No. In fact the problem was the potential customers were not turned off by too higher prices, just the opposite. The potential Chinese customer had an expectation that the prices should have been higher, or at least that was their expectation considering the exclusivity of the luxury brand, they thought the prices were too low. This aligned with the customer feeling that their product purchase was not exclusive and luxury enough. That was the barrier. When the market research company reported this back, the luxury company changed their strategy a little, and increased the prices across a wide section of the product range. The result? The company could not keep up, demand out stripped supply. The company has opened several other stores in key markets throughout China and are very successful today, and their pricing policy is considerably higher in mainland China than elsewhere, yet sales are doing better then ever here.
12-14-2012, 12:51 AM
SabineHartmann
Re: Loncin 重庆隆鑫机车有限公司
like Bikerdoc says; I will wait for the CF650. maybe until then, I can figure out how to get a bike legal in this town. until now there is no way.
12-14-2012, 01:38 AM
MJH
Re: Loncin 重庆隆鑫机车有限公司
They could raise the prices on imports and simultaneously introduce lower plate prices, actually lower plate prices for A plates in areas that currently ban motorcycles. That would allow the very wealthy to get the exclusive import brand they desire and the premium will make them feel special. The upper middle class will not be able to afford the luxury brands and plate prices, but could afford the domestic brands plus the lowered price of a plate.
I agree the probability of something I post on the internet affecting the regulations and policies of china are extremely low, but not zero though, simply because its on the internet.
I cannot imagine either selling very well, they both come with price tags starting around 7,000 EUR
Renault has a dealer network…that makes the Twizy worth much more.
It is not a secret that Loncin is behind this venture, its just that they are not advertising that they are, they are instead buying the rights to the name Zagato and using that name to sell the vehicle. Once again another example of brand name whoring, a brand name in reality is built over time, it then becomes ingrained in the minds of consumers through perceptions, however those perceptions in validity are based on real world experiences.
Zagato is a design house, they have nothing to lose in VOLPE, Renault is a auto manufacturer they have to maintain standards or consumers will avoid their brand.
Not using the Loncin brand name or diverting to another brand name is that an attempt to out Volpe the consumers?
12-30-2012, 02:04 AM
ZMC888
Re: Loncin 重庆隆鑫机车有限公司
43,800 RMB for an untried and untested (other than engine) single cylinder bike? You gotta be joking!
I'd take QJ/Benelli, Jialing or CFMOTO over this any day of the week. Yes they'll say 'but it has a BMW engine'. If you think having BMW's most unloved engine in your bike suddenly entitles you to an extra 10,000 RMB, not IMHO. Sales will probably reflect this. If however the price is wrong and it's actually 33,800 RMB still don't want it, as there is multi cylinder competition for a bit more and a proven single cylinder bike at that price.
12-30-2012, 01:09 PM
Kennon
Re: Loncin 重庆隆鑫机车有限公司
I have seen a fair few Renault Twizy especially in London being used as inner city transport they have there downsides though not having side windows but i have even seen one or two parked up at Uni
The Duster is not bad and for the price I would look at them....
12-30-2012, 02:41 PM
Kennon
Re: Loncin 重庆隆鑫机车有限公司
Dacia's have yet to be released in the UK but I've heard good things of them and seen so many Renault badged Dusters bowling about in Russia I would go for a Duster its such a cheap car aand £13K for diesel and 4wd its a very good deal, it all using Renault technology which is now very reliable since they've been joint with Nissan for a long time.
Kennon
12-30-2012, 02:47 PM
MJH
Re: Loncin 重庆隆鑫机车有限公司
If any Chinese manufacture wants to enter the US market they should look at what Dacia is doing in the UK, a vehicle that is under 3000lbs and has at least 100hp it should get 30mpg plus be priced between 9-15k.
There is also a huge hole in the market for a small utility truck here, Ford canceled the Ranger and Dodge canceled the Dakota. GM’s new line of small trucks begin at 17K for a base price.
A super simple base truck priced at 11K would sell well here.
12-30-2012, 05:25 PM
Zorge
Re: Loncin 重庆隆鑫机车有限公司
Guys, you are seriously wacky: from Loncin, over Renault to Dacia. It's more than off topic. :icon10:
Although I have to admit that, when is mentioning price of 7000 euros for Twizzy, first what crossed my mind was: "For that money you can buy basic Dacia Sandero or Logan.".
By the way, in my part of the world, Dacia Duster's prices vary from 9,500 euros for 1.6 2WD, to 16,650 euros for the 1.5 diesel 4WD, all with VAT. What to do, when Dacia's Mioveni plant is a few steps away...
And, is trhere any more news about Loncin-Kawasaki deal?
12-30-2012, 05:33 PM
Kennon
Re: Loncin 重庆隆鑫机车有限公司
I'm hoping the Renault takeover of Lada will produce something alright walking round the factory i've seen there has been allot fo changes for the assembly of new models.
perhaps duster chassis and drivetrain with hints of niva design characteristics
Kennon
12-30-2012, 06:35 PM
MJH
Re: Loncin 重庆隆鑫机车有限公司
But then again....the latest version is kind of cool.
Since there is a four door based on that platform and also a small truck, there is defiantly potential for a line.
If you strolling around the factory in Togliatti, it must have been quite a bit of stroll.
If you had the opportunity to walk through Lada's so-called "Greek hall", you would see a lot of interesting projects that are killed by chronic lack of money.
Mod will kill us. I'am getting outta here!
12-30-2012, 06:47 PM
Kennon
Re: Loncin 重庆隆鑫机车有限公司
i didnt see the Togliatti factory i saw the Izhevsk based factory i spent a month out there to learn russian and teach english