A really silly but basic question ?

[Sprocket]

Yeah, as you may be aware, I am new to motorcycles, and my efforts with my project before hitting the road, is take the thing apart and see how it is all put together and works, a method I use to understand machinery, and how I self taught my past plant fitter trade.

So, I have what I understand might be a silly question, but, it is one I just have to ask as I need to know and am too impatient to find out as that area of the bike to study is programmed for later, if I go there now, I will forget what has to be done first. I am kind of methodical like that, in whatever I do, I programme order of operations, and stick to it, any deviation, and I completely loose track of what has been done, and needs to be done. I also beat around the bush a lot when I write too, to that you have my apologies.

Anyway, the silly question is ; Is the gearbox seperate from the engine, regarding the lubrication fluids, are there seperate oils, one for engine and one for gearbox, or do both systems share the same oil ?


Oh Yeah, the bike is the Pulse Adrenaline 125 cc (XF125GY)

[ChinaV]

The oil in the gear box is shared throughout the engine. This is one reason motorcycles require better oil than cars, the clutch is pretty hard on the oil. Have fun taking things apart, it's a great way to learn.

Cheers!
ChinaV

[Sprocket]

Thankyou, I did suspect, but I needed affirmation on this issue from experienced people.

My next question would be the question of what oil to use, Sae 10W40 and a litre of I know, but is there any advantage with the semi synthetic or fully synthetic oils for this size of machine?

Also what oil would people here recommend, Silkolene, Morris whatever ?

( I mentioned Morris, as I ran my air cooled VW transporter for ten years on Morris SAE 30,it performed fine. The only time I had a problem with that motor, a 1600cc was shortly after I got it, when the ignition strangely advanced and blew a hole through the number three piston, setting fire to the oil and leaving a trail of burning oil down the road, it issuing from the blown gasket seals on the rocker cover. What oil was in it at that point, who knows,but I did find when I took the engine apart two pistons and cylinders had been replaced on one side of the engine only, there giving unequal combustion forces across the boxer motor, and the previous owner was a bit of a plank, I found the corners he cut).

[ChinaV]

We could debate oil for many days, I prefer 20w50 in the summer over 10w40. There are only two things people seem to always agree on.
#1 Change your oil frequently.
#2 Motorcycles need motorcycle oil, not the stuff you put in your car.
What brand you choose or synthetic blend is like religion, everyone has an opinion.
Cheers!
ChinaV

[david3921]

From what I have learned, if you want to run synthetic, change over after the motorcycle break in period. I think this has to do with cost rather than limitations in the oil. The thinking is that the break in period requires more frequent oil changes so it will cost more if synthetic is used. ChinaV is correct in stating that only oil intended for motorcycles is to be used.

[davidqc]

It's not a matter of bike oils being 'better' than car oils. It's just that they are different to meet different operating conditions. Oil for a sowing machine is different to oils used in marine engines and jet engines. Horses for courses as they say.

There is a nice article about why you should not use car oil in bikes - click here

Just make sure that JASO MA appears somewhere on the container.

The above applies to bikes with wet clutches.

The exception is in the use of plain mineral oil, which is usually labeled as car oil - in the UK at least. For Chinese clones of older Japanese engines (e.g. 157FMI), plain mineral oil is fine and you really don't need to go for the fancy and more pricey semi/fully synth oils.

Of course only use plain mineral oil (never semi or fully synth oil) for running-in (breaking-in in the US).

It is the regularity of oil changes that is important.

[Sprocket]

Out in the rain today, I was drilling holes, later to be stuffed with JB-Weld, (Easy out snapped in the hole, so drilled the lot out), taking bits off for repair and painting and whilst out there, and whilst I was wet, I may as well continue messing about, I took the oil filter out to check if it was the same as my Highflfiltro HF 131, which had arrived in the post this morning. The HF131 for the Suzuki DT125 fits perfectly, it is the same as the OEM part, except for the colour of the filter medium, the HF131 being a pinky red, (just like the K & N performance oil filter), the OEM part filter medium is yellow and with the one I pulled out, cause for concern. Now this machine has done 4000 miles, so is past the running in period if done in the traditional way, which incidently, is not my way, from experience, I tend to agree with this ;

http://www.mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm.

Anyway, this bike I bought had a receipt for a service carried out in November 2009, to include oil and filter change, all of which according to receipt took half an hour, which is fair enough, but on pulling the oil filter, the valleys in between the fins were loaded with crap, bits of metal, which I can see is aluminium, and bits of red and white material, the filter medium itself did not look very new either, just to note the bike has done three miles since the odometer reading taken at the service. So, it is obvious the filter has not been changed, has it ever been changed I wonder and so with that I am wondering about the oil, yes, I was going to change it anyway, but am now thinking about an engine flush and the fitment of a magnetic drain plug for anything ferrous. Or, I could just install the new filter and new oil, and then run it about for a bit and do the service again in a couple of weeks to see what is happening, there using the new oil as a in operation flush.

The outlet where the service was carried out has now closed down, gone out of business, so there is no way I can go there even if I wanted to. One thing I just have to say to everyone else, here in the UK beware of garages that do services, unless you actually watch the mechanic service your machine, beware, not all do what they charge you for, it is unfortunate, but the baddies ruin everything for the real mechanics who do care beyond the payment.

[Sprocket]

It's not a matter of bike oils being 'better' than car oils. It's just that they are different to meet different operating conditions. Oil for a sowing machine is different to oils used in marine engines and jet engines. Horses for courses as they say.

There is a nice article about why you should not use car oil in bikes - click here

Just make sure that JASO MA appears somewhere on the container.

The above applies to bikes with wet clutches.

The exception is in the use of plain mineral oil, which is usually labeled as car oil - in the UK at least. For Chinese clones of older Japanese engines (e.g. 157FMI), plain mineral oil is fine and you really don't need to go for the fancy and more pricey semi/fully synth oils.

Of course only use plain mineral oil (never semi or fully synth oil) for running-in (breaking-in in the US).

It is the regularity of oil changes that is important.

Thanks for the info, the links you provided are good, and do offer food for thought, but it is my intention to do regular oil changes, as from what I can see, the materials do not add up to much, a filter, a litre of oil, clean the spark plug, and clean the air filter, so really cheap then, compared to a car.

[davidqc]

One of the local boyo's has a 15 year old SUzi - looks 50 years old from a skip - in which he uses old frying oil from the local chippy. Mind you, he tells me he changes it every week!!