Recommendation which moto to buy

[kikikillercat]

If you have already been burnt by a sub-standard Chinabike I would buy a Jianshe Yamaha YBR250 and then copy the YBR125KG as a template.
Attachment 16621
and buy some parts on Taobao.

the difference only being the tires and hand guards?

[ZMC888]

the difference only being the tires and hand guards?

....and some extra mud clearance on the front fender and a mini wind screen plus a guard, then some luggage racks and hard cases if needed for touring. It is a bit tricky to find suitable good quality front tire in road trail form.

China V also bought a Galaxy 250 and said he wished he'd bought a YBR250 instead.

[td_ref]

German cars, Japs bikes, … girls (cough, I am not the right person to say this).

[ZMC888]

German cars, Japs bikes, … girls (cough, I am not the right person to say this).

No dude. Italian cars, German beer, British bikes and Swedish women.....but I'm too poor to afford them all.

[modron]

No dude. Italian cars, German beer, British bikes and Swedish women.....but I'm too poor to afford them all.

American cars instead of Italian ones, the rest sounds about right



Going back to KTM Duke 390, Ive watched couple of videos on youtube about it and there is one made by guy fro India who says it costs a little more than half of European price. I was shocked so I checked and it costs about 187000rupee which is below 19000RMB. In Europe it costs about 5500Euros which is about 42000RMB
I thought there is no high tax on bikes made/assembled here

What the hell China??

[bikerdoc]

I discussed this elsewhere in MCM...
...the MSRP for the Dukes made in India is about a third of the MSRP in PRC. Me thinks this is related to the Dukes being assembled from CKD kits imported from the Indian factory, which likely results in still 30-40% [ASEAN] import duties and taxes, rather than a truly wholly manufactured PRC bike. Just a guess...

[ZMC888]

I discussed this elsewhere in MCM...
...the MSRP for the Dukes made in India is about a third of the MSRP in PRC. Me thinks this is related to the Dukes being assembled from CKD kits imported from the Indian factory, which likely results in still 30-40% [ASEAN] import duties and taxes, rather than a truly wholly manufactured PRC bike. Just a guess...

40,000 is fair, and for that price they'd sell a lot. I think parts are taxed at 20% when imported.

50,000 is just too much. I think some people are getting greedy for scared. Someone probably thinks that KTM are a 'premium European product like BMW' and want the price to reflect that. Or they are worried that at 40,000 they would kill off much of the demand for the 650NK, BN600 etc.

However if it's made in India and assembled in China I struggle to see the 'premiumness'. Even though 20,000 more a Thai made Honda CB500 is probably better value, as its going to be better manufactured and better assembled.

[bikerdoc]

40,000 is fair, and for that price they'd sell a lot. I think parts are taxed at 20% when imported.

50,000 is just too much. I think some people are getting greedy for scared. Someone probably thinks that KTM are a 'premium European product like BMW' and want the price to reflect that. Or they are worried that at 40,000 they would kill off much of the demand for the 650NK, BN600 etc.

However if it's made in India and assembled in China I struggle to see the 'premiumness'. Even though 20,000 more a Thai made Honda CB500 is probably better value, as its going to be better manufactured and better assembled.

I agree wholeheartedly to some extent - not sure about the extent to which various components attract duties and taxes etc. Some might argue that an Austrian brand is still a premium brand (not necessarily a luxury brand), despite where it is built, and the price reflects that. I don't necessarily agree with that, but some premium and luxury brands have discovered that when 'they' entered the PRC market, products did not meet sales forecasts. This left these companies scratching their marketing dept. heads - why?

When some potential consumers were asked why by market analysts ... the brands in question discovered that the locals perception was one of perceived value perception vs. price sensitivity. Upshot being that prices were seen as soft (set too low), and once the luxury brands responded by repositioning prices for the intended market (more expensive) sales increased exponentially. Those sluggish sales very quickly increased beyond sales targets initially set.
Most of us will know of these luxury brands...
TIC! - LFZ!

Anecdotally the KTM-CFMoto Duke390 is selling very very well - if the info I have been provided is to be believed. Supposedly just the volume sold through a newer Hangzhou store has seen supply unable to keep pace with demand. CFMoto (KTM) cannot keep up with demand - is my understanding. But who knows... smoke and mirrors, and all that jazz...

[ZMC888]

I agree wholeheartedly to some extent - not sure about the extent to which various components attract duties and taxes etc. Some might argue that an Austrian brand is still a premium brand (not necessarily a luxury brand), despite where it is built, and the price reflects that. I don't necessarily agree with that, but some premium and luxury brands have discovered that when 'they' entered the PRC market, products did not meet sales forecasts. This left these companies scratching their marketing dept. heads - why?

When some potential consumers were asked why by market aanlysts ... the brands in question discovered that the locals perception was one of perceived value perception vs. price sensitivity. Upshot being that prices were seen as soft (set too low), and once the luxury brands responded by repositioning prices for the intended market (more expensive) sales increased exponentially. Those sluggish sales very quickly increased beyond sales targets initially set.
Most of us will know of these luxury brands...
TIC! - LFZ!

Anecdotally the KTM-CFMoto Duke390 is selling very very well. Just the volume sold through a newer Hangzhou store has seen supply unable to keep pace with demand. CFMoto (KTM) cannot keep up with demand - is my understanding. But who knows... smoke and mirrors, and all that jazz...

As always I'm analyzing what bike I want next, and realistically that's every three years, and my bike is only a year old, but it's still nice to stay up to date with the things that are happening as it can keep my opinions valid. I'm quite a greenie so if I lived in my home country I think I'd have a Zero SR or something like it for commuting, but when the prices could drop a bit lower in a few years. Then if I could afford it something like a Triumph Daytona or CBR600F for track and various other kinds of riding, quite easy choices.

However in restricted China things get complicated. I really would be torn between the KTM Duke 390 and Honda CB500F right now if I were buying again. Actually the KTM might win, just because of the more attainable lower price, but being made in India and assembled in China it really does some leave some scope for worry. Sure you'd get a warranty, however it is somewhat likely you might need at some point to claim on it with all the annoyance and frustration that can entail, this is really much less likely with a Thai made Honda IMO.

[bikerdoc]

^similar thought process ZMC888.
I'd have a Zero DS or if someone did a maxi e-scoot I'd be a potential customer if the prices were realistic, and there were better range offerings - range anxiety is more than just an emotion but a reality as I discovered having owned several e-scoots here over the years. I've been known to push previously owned ranges of e-scoots. I've had to call on the services of the local Suzuki dealer to come collect me and my 'flat' e-scoots in their Ford Transit, in days past.

As for the petrol moto offerings, with the Thai manufactured KLE650 (Versys) offering at 83500, and the likely availability of the Thailand manufactured Honda CB500X... maybe these will help just the push of the local market flood gates most of us wish for (fingers croxxed).

To my mind the locally manufacured moto's offer few attractions other than supposed part affordability and availability - and even sometimes these are mere concepts than a reality.