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#1 QM200GY idle problem, valve clearances.
- Join Date
- Jun 2008
- Location
- Gijon, Asturias, Northern Spain
- Posts
- 580
07-12-2008, 02:10 AMAlthough very happy with my Qingqi-Qlink-Sinnis-Pulse adrenaline-Superbyke, etc QM200GY super motard so far,
I was never comfortable with the abscence of valve clearance check and/or adjustment in the makers handbook
maintenance schedule.
The Spanish importer tells me it's not required, EVER. Having ridden and
maintained bikes and cars for over 30 years I know this is pure bullsh*t, but
finally managed to get the settings out of him.
They told me 0.5 inlet and 0.8 exhaust. When I laughed at the ridiculously
large clearances for a Japanese-derived bike engine, the service manager went quiet,
consulted some papers and came up with the more reasonable 0.05 and 0.08. This, I reluctantly accepted.
As I am unable to locate a workshop manual for the Qingqi I bought one for its nearest equivalent,
the Suzuki DR200SE and learned there that Suzuki's clearances for both inlet and exhaust are 0.08 to 0.13 mm.
Thinking this was strange I searched through many forums, in several languages
and using the various names Qingqis are sold as in different countries.
I came across contributor "Catastrophyx" advice, backed by Qingqi Sweden,
concerning the problem with burned valves and advice to set them at inlet 0.10 and exhaust 0.15 mm.
Like all information that could be useful for future reference I copied the
messages to my desktop and forgot about it.
From 500 km onwards the bike started dying out ocassionally on stopping for
traffic lights, junctions, etc, and it re-started with some difficulty and in a
lazy sort of manner, being reluctant to rev up or respond properly to the
throttle. There was also a sort of low speed jerkiness. At speed, once under
way, it ran well and also from cold starts.
The idle speed was also badly affected by turning on the lights, making it
necessary to set the idle speed high with them off to avoid the idle becoming
too low with the lights on.
This is fairly normal on small engines with a low power output, but I thought
that a 200cc 4-stroke would have enough torque at idle to cope with an
electrical load of about 50 or 60 watts.
After wasting several days re-adjusting carburettor, cleaning and dismantling,
checking float chamber level, air leaks, ignition system, changing plugs,
testing breather hole in petrol cap, fuel flow from tank, etc, etc, I was about
to give up and just accept that I was beaten when I remembered my notes
about valve clearances. These I did not think to check at such an early mileage.
Before doing so I searched the Net to see if incorrect clearances could affect
things like the tickover and finding that it definitely could, I rushed to my
garage to check them out.
I found that they were at 0.04 and 0.06 respectively, probably adjusted to
the standard 0.05 and 0.08 in the factory, but due to initial valve seat settlement or recession,
they had closed up in 660 Km.
I decided to reset them to the figures according to the advice of the Swedish
Qingqi importer and forum contributor "CathastrophiX" (IN 0.10-EX 0.15mm).
I'm happy to say that this has cured all the troubles, the bike runs like a
sewing machine and the idle speed is now steady and totally reliable.
It also pulls much better from low revs.
I just hope that I caught it on time, avoiding a burned or damaged valve seat,
but for now hope that this advice is read by others with similar symptoms and acted upon without delay.Jincheng Monkey JC50Q-7
Skyteam Dax replica ST110-6
Zongshen ZS125-43
Qingqi QM200GY-BA Super Motard
Qingqi QM110GY
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07-12-2008, 05:06 AM
Forch,
That's great news! I can't believe people tell experienced riders things like: "The valves never need adjustment." Not sure if I should be insulted or not.
Glad it solved your problems and I also experienced a bit of this on the black 200GY I had, which is now ChinaV's. He'll be happy to know this will likely solve the erratic idle and stalling problem.
You have any trouble doing the adjustment? How long did it take? Got pics?
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#3 Valve clearance adjustment QM200GY
- Join Date
- Jun 2008
- Location
- Gijon, Asturias, Northern Spain
- Posts
- 580
07-12-2008, 08:44 AMI can reproduce a post from the same chap that gave the clearance advice. I hope he doesn't mind.
The procedure is just right with the exception that I took off the tank as it doesn't take long and you can see things better:
Adjusted the valves on my QM200GY today. You donīt have to remove the tank or plastics to do this, (itīs fiddly but doable).
You need:
17 mm ring spanner
10 mm ring spanner
Screwdriver bit
10 mm Allen wrench
17 mm socket
0,10 and 0,15 mm measure blades?
Remove the two valve inspection caps on the top of the engine (17 mm)
Remove the chrome inspection bolt on top of the left crank case (17 mm).
Remove the allen cap (10 mm) in the center of the left crank case.
Use the 17 mm socket to turn the engine over until the mark on the fly wheel matches the TDC mark on the crankcase. (Make sure youīre on the right stroke).
Then you can adjust your valves to these clearances:
IN 0,10 mm
EX 0,15 mm
The locking nut is 10 mm, use the screwdriver bit to turn the pin.
If your hands are too big, itīs easier if you remove the right tank plastic (3 philips screws), the gas wire from the carburettor and the rubber hose (that goes from the "EGR" valve to the air box) from the air box.
By the way his signature is "Failure is always an option", but don't let it worry youJincheng Monkey JC50Q-7
Skyteam Dax replica ST110-6
Zongshen ZS125-43
Qingqi QM200GY-BA Super Motard
Qingqi QM110GY
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#4 Valve clearance adjustment
- Join Date
- Jun 2008
- Location
- Gijon, Asturias, Northern Spain
- Posts
- 580
07-12-2008, 09:01 AMAlthough for a different bike, there's a good tutorial on a thread in another China bike forum. The engine and adjuster layout is very similar to the Qingqi:
http://www.chinariders.net/modules.p...ewtopic&t=1655Jincheng Monkey JC50Q-7
Skyteam Dax replica ST110-6
Zongshen ZS125-43
Qingqi QM200GY-BA Super Motard
Qingqi QM110GY
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- Join Date
- Jul 2008
- Location
- Ukraine
- Posts
- 8
07-13-2008, 09:28 PMIf you wish to control clearance valves, first of all it is necessary to remove Spark plug.
Further unscrew covers from windows of adjustment of valves.
Unscrew a cover which closes access to the screw of twirl of the crankshaft (from the left party engine).
Into a window of installation Spark plug put in a long screw-driver and very easily rest it against the piston.
Twirl the crankshaft a tubular key through a window in the left party engine. It is necessary to twirl only counter-clockwise. One arm twirl the crankshaft and other arm control a position of the piston using a long screw-driver. As soon as the piston will reach the overhead point - stop twirl and test the arm a free course both rocker arm. If the free course is at both rocker arm, begin adjustment clearance valves. If you could not lift and haul down freely inlet and exhaust rocker arm - continue to twirl the crankshaft up to a following overhead point and again test a free course rocker arm.
In Ukraine the big community of owners qingqi-motard. A lot of the interesting information on qingqi-motard you can find on http://www.motodrive.com.ua/forum/in...ic=6395&st=740
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#6 200cc official valve clearance specs...07-23-2008, 04:34 AM
This just in....
The official valve clearance spec for the QingQi 200cc motor is...
<drum roll>
.06 to .08mm for both intake and exhaust.
In other news, they have finished testing their new 250cc motor and sent some specs which need to be translated.
More on this later...
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- Join Date
- Jul 2008
- Location
- Tegucigalpa, Honduras, Central America
- Posts
- 19
07-25-2008, 02:34 AMHi Carl! Very interesting what Forchetto said previously, about his results with the more generous clearances he have tried and seemed to work so well for him. Know of any possible reason the official recommended clearances differ so much? Is it normal for this kind of engine to get out of adjustment so early as 660 km?
Thanks in advance.
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- Join Date
- Jun 2008
- Location
- Gijon, Asturias, Northern Spain
- Posts
- 580
07-25-2008, 05:02 AMSorry to answer instead of Carl, but I've owned many 4-strokes in the past and I've never had an engine that needed the valves adjusting this early. Perhaps they had not settled with recession, but were simply too tight from the factory.
My experience is that the valve clearances tend to open up with mileage, not close up.
The settings I mentioned in the main post (IN 0.10mm EX 0.15mm) work well enough, but produce a noticeable clicking sound when hot. Don't know if that will accelerate wear on the valve gear to any extent.
Now it seems as if Qingqi have decided on another set of clearances...I wish they made their mind up... Can't help thinking that as this is a Suzuki DR200 like engine, why are the specs not the same?. I can only assume that they fit a different camshaft to reduce power output, the same way the Suzi has a 31 mm carb against the Qingqi's 28mm.Jincheng Monkey JC50Q-7
Skyteam Dax replica ST110-6
Zongshen ZS125-43
Qingqi QM200GY-BA Super Motard
Qingqi QM110GY
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- Join Date
- Jul 2008
- Location
- Tegucigalpa, Honduras, Central America
- Posts
- 19
07-26-2008, 06:52 AMDonīt mention it. Your comment is really appreciated. What Iīm thinking up right now is that it will really suck to get beaten by a not-as-trick-looking-Suzuki DR200SE. Qingqi manufacturing and design efforts donīt deserve that. Why in this God`s Planet Earth did they choose to give their engines a lower power output? It really goes beyond my comprehension. From a practical point of view: Could we upgrade the motor to current Suzuki standards by switching parts or even exceed Big Yellow performance? Just curious to ask (but dying of anxiety about having a positive response). I better go to bed. Wifeīs getting upset. Good night Pal.
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07-26-2008, 07:36 AM
Part of the power restrictions on the 200GY's may come from the company stressing the ability for these machines to pass American and European emissions standards. There's a lot of sweating going on now by some manufacturers because they are affraid the only way to pass the new Euro standards is to move to Fuel Injection....but it takes years to sort out FI on bikes. Even many of the big Japanese companies still haven't work their out yet.
Be honest with you guys, my guess is there's no sure way to tell if Zuki parts will work with no problems without trying it.
I would think sticking a DR200 carb on it would be the first step, then install a DR cam or head. I know other parts like wheels and headlight can be succesfully changed over but, as far as I know, no one has tried swapping engine parts from a DR200.
I guess the idea thing would be to take a DR200 and QM200GY side by side and document their dissasembly. I don't have access to the resources so can't do it imyself.
Qingqi might not be able to officially say whether or not the parts are directly swappable. To legally release these engines under Qingqi name, one could assume that there is a licensing agreement between Suzuki and QQ. This may require lower output engines as part of the deal but I can't verify that.
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