Greetings from Chongqing.

[bigdamo]

Husqvarna will be colaborating with Loncin from next year. BMW already share technical knowhow and staff with Loncin. It's pretty wierd looking inside the Loncin factory because there is a section which is clearly more technically advanced and safety concsious than the rest of the factory, it is of course the BMW part.

That's a shame long time Husky fan and owner.But i sure as hell won't have anything to do with them if they turn Chinese.Just look at the Jialing debacle.

[ZMC888]

That's a shame long time Husky fan and owner.But i sure as hell won't have anything to do with them if they turn Chinese.Just look at the Jialing debacle

I think having ridden joint venture Hondas and Yamahas that it's pretty safe so long as the company is only half Chinese. The 100% Chinese bike companies though could be a could worms that I don't want to open.

[David McMullan]

If any Chinese companies want to be taken seriously they will have to stick their neck out and enter a team in Moto2 or eqivalent. Loncin had their daliance with moto125 but their wasn't much 'Loncin' about the bike.

FIM have told me that they are very willing to give Chinese companies all the help they need in entering top competions but as usual the companies are not too far thinking.

[ZMC888]

I think if Chinese motorcycle companies want to be taken seriously they need to do a few things. A few examples....

-Build their own brand name, take it seriously and stop hiding behind local market re-branding. Provide excellent customer warranty and support.
-Employ people who have a love for bikes and have a genuine passion for them, not just family friends or people who have no clue or love cars.
-Hunt for employees with skill and enthusiasm, in China and abroad, and let them flourish in their work and have a real impact on the companies' direction.
-Do their own market research and R&D, and stop stealing technology and using their customers as free R&D.
-Take more care in the factory, torque bolts properly, use thread-lockers grease parts and think about their end users' safety, not pump out as many bikes as possible for max profits.
-Get involved in spectator motorsports of some kind, and pay foreign riders as well as local ones to ride for you.
-Be ahead of the game with electric/hybrid bikes, not lagging behind doing cheap copies.
-Forge relationships with or even buy out foreign companies and gain new technology fairly and legally.
-Treat their customers properly even in China, go the extra mile for them and fix problems, to build long term good-will and reputation even sometimes outside of legal warranty. Above all NEVER lie to your customers or treat them as idiots.
-Learn how to take criticism gratefully as a constructive tool to help you improve your product.

Basically only a few brands will survive long term, and the companies who are able to do at least some of the above things will most likely be the winners. The companies with despotic leadership who refuse to listen to their customers will be the ones that die.

[David McMullan]

That pretty much sums up what they need to do. Not many of the smaller companies are looking long term, the general concensus in Chongqing is that the industry has only got 5 years left in it (mind you I heard that 5 years ago)! I think for most of them it's a case of 'making hay while the sun shines' as when emerging markets become saturated it will be only the bigger companies that will have the ability to open up properly on western markets.

[euphonius]

...I think for most of them it's a case of 'making hay while the sun shines' as when emerging markets become saturated it will be only the bigger companies that will have the ability to open up properly on western markets.

Bloody hell, what about their own market? With a bit of care and feeding, and some intelligent marketing that regarded motorcyclists as people with choice rather than stupid, hapless farmers, these guys could sell hundreds of thousands of premium-priced bikes a year in China, and rapidly build their skills and brands in the process. The big four in Japan did this despite having a population just one-tenth the size, then Honda tackled the US market in earnest, making mistakes and learning from them, and becoming best of breed.

Do you think that anyone in the boardrooms of Honda, Kawasaki, Yamaha or Suzuki sees their industry as having only five years left? What about BMW, Ducati, Triumph or Harley? All of those, to varying degrees, are readjusting and preparing for the future, which is now.

At Jialing and its ilk, with this kind of thinking, the five-year horizon will become a reality and China will be buzzing with efficient, zero carbon vehicles that are fun and popular with customers -- and branded Honda, Suzuki, Yamaha, Kawasaki, BMW, Ducati, Triumph and Harley.

And they will fully deserve this fate.

/rant

cheers

[euphonius]

I kind of wish this thread were called,

How China's motorcycle industry is committing slow suicide

or, for the pollyannas among us,

How China's motorcycle industry could dodge death and flourish

And put it in the Manufacturers' Info and Discussion forum.

cheers

[David McMullan]

The domestic market becomes more and more screwed due to the ban on motorcycles in many urban areas. It's the smaller factories that have the '5 year' attitude not the likes of Jialing, Loncin etc who are making constant noises about how they plan to take over Europe. To their credit, Chinese motorcycle companies do put up a good showing at Milan Eicma and the Cologne shows despite Cologne marginalising Chinese companies blatantly with regard to positioning in the exhibition.

[ZMC888]

With a bit of care and feeding, and some intelligent marketing that regarded motorcyclists as people with choice rather than stupid, hapless farmers, these guys could sell hundreds of thousands of premium-priced bikes a year in China, and rapidly build their skills and brands in the process. The big four in Japan did this despite having a population just one-tenth the size, then Honda tackled the US market in earnest, making mistakes and learning from them, and becoming best of breed.

Exactly! There already is a grassroots of motorcycle enthusiasts across age ranges in China. Also the younger age groups there are a good solid percentage who are bored of cars and traffic gridlock already, and could become skilled competent long term riders. It is sad that I feel these Chinese riders are being bullied into cars, by the majority who seem to really believe that not having a car is a massive loss of face, and must be in the 'car club' which is patriotic because it drives forward the automotive market and a good chunk of the economic growth. Are there no words for 'unsustainable', 'futile' and 'gridlock' in Chinese?

[MJH]

I have a question, what is, if any, the connection with ZONTES and Daimler? ZONTES also goes by Haojiang and also GUANGDONG Tayo Motorcyle Technolgy Co,,LTD.

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