Recomendation for Dual-sport Bike for Trip from China to Europe

[Lao Jia Hou]

Slightly off-topic, slightly on-topic rant.

Re: China not recognizing overseas driving licenses.

I've been away from my home country (Canada) for a long time, as a non-resident (of Canada). Hence, my Canadian driving license expired several years ago (I couldn't renew it because I am a non-resident). I hold a 10 year China driving license (you get 10 years after one's initial 6 year expires, if one has been a good boy).

So, I am recently in Canada. British Columbia recognizes a Chinese driving license, and one can drive with it for 6 months (as a tourist) or 3 months (as a new resident), before needing to get a local DL. Further, I can easily exchange my Chinese driving license for a new BC driving license. I've heard the same exists for most (if not all) Canadian provinces and US states.

Interestingly, though, because China is not a party to the IDP convention, I cannot get an IDP in China. In fact, the Canadian police know that if they stop a Chinese person, who shows an IDP along with a Chinese DL, that the documents are most likely false (gee ... really? False documents out of China?). So, instead, there are these "official translators" who do a Chinese DL translation for 50 bucks. Still, I can drive around with my Chinese DL for several months, no problem.

Reciprocity? Hah! Yeah right.

So, I asked a local official (Beijing) about this ... his deadpan response was "well, Canadians won't have the special training & skills needed for driving in China." Seriously buddy? I kept my mouth shut, but felt like asking him ... Ever been to Richmond, BC, and seen all the Chinese drivers exercising their "special skills & training"?

Anyways, I doubt I will see it in my lifetime where China opens up and recognizes overseas driving licenses.

[bikerdoc]

This link to Motorhome China PRC DL for visitors to PRC, looked promising, until one looks at the picture of the DL near the bottom of the webpage. Note the title of the DL... 'Provisional Driving Permit' and importantly note the red stamp 'Operation of Rental Car Only' aside from the period of validity which appears to be one month, too bad. Also this is for BJ, doesn't mean that the same can be done elsewhere. One kingdoOm, multiple empires.

dl_license1.jpg

This ZYUE SH link is useful to understand the process and relevant Simplified Ch!nese used throughout used in Shanghai... 'cause all things being equal, Ch!na does not practice equality.

The Yabroad website is useful for understanding how one gets a PRC DL, but read the question posed at the bottom of the webpage...

Q: "can i get a drivers license with only a tourist visa or do i need a Chinese ID card/ work permit?"
​jack_russell_dog 2013-11-08 14:18:53

A: "I haven't seen any regulations specifying with which types of visa one may apply for a license; but I'm optimistic about getting a license even if you're holding a tourist visa. If you can't get one by yourself you can ask an agency to do it for you, like this one: http://www.zyue.com/zhuanti/huanjiazhao/ Good luck!" Daoyuan Li 2013-11-08 14:29:33

[prince666]

Laos/Thailand (and Cambodia) aren't really a problem, especially if you have the proper permission letter also written in English, copies of her ID Card, etc. Those borders are comparatively easy crossings, with many travelers on bike and in cars doing it every day. In fact, I know that many illegal bikes with fake paperwork commonly cross.

Mongolia is also doable, at predetermined crossings, although the Mongolian Embassy strongly recommends that one has an "official translation" of each of the registration documents and permission letter (done by the Embassy, of course, for $50 US per document).

Where it gets tricky is when you get further afield. Speaking from experience, border guards have tremendous discretion - if they want to make your life difficult, because they had a fight with their wife, or because they didn't get their coffee break, they will.

There are reports over on HUBB about people getting stranded in no-man's land (that common stretch of a km, or two found between many border crossings), where the entering country said "nope, can't come in" and the exiting country saying "nope, can't come back". I can't recall which forum/blog I read it on, but two Chinese bikes heading into Mongolia were caught in this mess, and they were forced to sell their bikes to the "kind & considerate" border guards who offered them 10 cents on the dollar.

Then again, other crossing reports say "they didn't even ask to see my DL or registration".

Thank you for posting I think you are correct the country that I am planing to visit should
Be ok with what documents I have at hand .

[culcune]

You could get a new 125cc-150cc bike trail(ish) for about $1200-$1400. A real YBR125G is your best bet, or maybe a factory Jialing JH125 or 150.

I think from reading about them the Jialing should be high on your list of bikes. The founder of this site, Carl Parker, did a long trip on a Jialing 150 and others have owned them and seemed to have very good results judging by their posts.

[davidzweig]

Thanks for the information, sorry I can't respond more fully just now.

We're considering crossing China on trains, possibly with folding bicycles. When we cross into Kyrgyzstan, we'd get a bike there. It's hard to weight up the risks of driving without a license, have been trawling the forums this-afternoon. If anyone has some more advice or information about this, it would be really helpful, you could PM us if you'd rather.

[ZMC888]

David, the problem is the rules are not consistently enforced. We know a French guy who bought a stolen (from HK) Suzuki Gixxer 600 in Shanghai, no license, plates, insurance........nothing. He was welcomed onto the freeway towards Beijing for free by traffic police, go figure! Another guy had a motorcycle license and a car license but rode out of class with a three-wheeler in Shanghai and ended up in a detention center.

My opinion is outside of a big city you're 95% safe....unless you have an accident, particularly with an ebike, bicycle or pedestrian you could have a bad day.

So on this site we have a real problem giving advice. Do we tell people to break the law, or do we hit them with the rule book as it's written? Sucks but that's how it is.

[davidzweig]

I did some more digging online today about the driving license.

If we can get a 60-day or better, a 90-day visa, seems I can sit the computerised test and get a real license quite easily in about 5 days:

"""You can get a license on a tourist visa. I did in April 2013. You just need a residence certificate. This is not a residence permit, which is the same thing as a work visa. A residence certificate is just a document the police give you when you go to register your apartment at the police office. There are also some other documents you need to have like photocopies of your passport (photo page and visa/entry stamp pages), photos (you can get them there), and the approved translation of your foreign drivers license.

The test itself is in English. The questions as of the new 2013 test are totally reasonable. All the odd questions about first aid, what to do if you are submerged in water, how to jump out of the window, etc are gone."""

http://www.gokunming.com/en/forums/t...license?page=2

Need to figure out if I could get a residence certificate though.

In the comments on this page ( http://teachabroadchina.com/riding-m...cles-in-china/ ) some people claim a Hong Kong driver's license is valid in China, and you can convert your exisiting license in Hong Kong for $120 USD. ( http://www.td.gov.hk/en/public_servi...ving_licence_/ ). Others say this is not true. WikiTravel says a HK license is not valid in China (http://wikitravel.org/en/Driving_in_China#Licences).

On this page ( http://www.gokunming.com/en/forums/t...riving_license ) it says a HK license would allow you to skip taking the written and practical tests in getting a PRC DL, but only in Guangdong, which recognizes a HK DL.

"""...the required docs were as followings,

1. HKDL original and two A4 copies of the front and back the same.

2. Visa permitting 3 month stay or longer. And copies of your passport and visa.

3. Shenzhen resident card from the PSB, to prove that you are indeed a Guangdong resident.

3. 2x photo and one digitized photo sent to the licensing dept.

4. Medical certificate from a approved hospital.

5. Money :-) about 600ish and takes a 3 day wait."""

***

Any input or help welcome :-)

[davidzweig]

A used bike would allow us to sidestep the problem of registering the bike in our name, plus maybe save some money and the 'teething problems' associated with poorly assembled new bikes. What are the sites for classified ads in the area around Guangzhou?

I guess we would try to get a notarized translation of the Bill-of Sale (into Russian and English), with photocopies of his and my passports. Also translations of the registration documents. Hopefully this should be enough for the border crossings.

[davidzweig]

Didn't get around to getting the visa in Manila, so will have to try in Macau or Hong-Kong.

Hong Kong seems pretty alright still, but you only get a 30-day single-entry visa. ( https://www.lonelyplanet.com/thorntr...ng-kong?page=2 )

[bikerdoc]

Kind of related....
http://doherty.net.au

You might be lucky, you might be able to get a DL in 5 days, you might be able to organise to sit the test in fairly quick succession after arrival, you might be able to get a longer duration visa that might then give you the duration of stay that then might make you eligible for a foreign D/L -> PRC D/L conversion, you might be able to find someone willing to sell you a bike and not worry about the plate (actually out of all the might's this is almost a certainty), you might be able to find someone who can fudge you an apartment or some such rental agreement that then, might allow you to go register in the approved PSB that keeps a register of foreigners (given that not all PSB Stations can). You might be able to get a HK D/L just so you might be able to convert that to a PRC D/L... and you might be able to do that without needing to sit a written/computerised D/L test. You might be able to get M/C insurance in your name even if a M/C is another persons name (this is a little trickier to accomplish)... you might be able to accomplish all of this with a dependable/reliable MC on the US$1000 budget you set yourself... - I've my doubts...



As stated previously and elsewhere PRC is one big country full of little kingdoOms, each little territory, village, district, town, city, province, makes its own set of 'rules' which may or may not be enforced, and then there is the big mother-ship... one set of regulations and rules in one jurisdiction may or may not apply elsewhere.

Kudos to you though if you can pull it all off.